No, because it has too many possible side effects.
And, " * Narrow Therapeutic Index: The difference between a safe dose and a toxic one is small. Overdose can be fatal and requires immediate medical attention.
There is currently no quality clinical evidence to suggest that colchicine can cure or reduce tinnitus.
So, I’ll pass on this intervention.
I think grip strength is mostly about the strength of the forearm muscles, not how much pressure you can tolerate on your palms or finger pads. Some, like Peter Attia, speculate that grip strength is a proxy for overall body strength because it develops when you lift weights or have a lifestyle that engages with heavy stuff. All the research I’ve read on the topic has been correlational, so I tend to agree with Attia. You might want to consider padded gym gloves to make things more comfortable. I find those help. Some of us lose fat pads in the hands and feet as we age, so that could be a factor in comfort.
That makes a lot of sense! Yeah, even when doing a bench press, while I can press a lot of weight relative to my size, the weight of the bar on my bony little fingers is deathly! I’ll look for a pair of gloves. It takes a village!
Wow, I learned something new “Narrow therapeutic Index” and a very important one to be aware of. From now on, you are my favorite doc LOL. Thank you. Out of curiosity, are you aware of any of the common drugs we are taking that fit this category? I know Rapa is not and some of the lipid and glucose lowering ones are not either, but maybe some of less common ones we discuss in these boards, i.e Dayvigo, Selegiline, captopril etc…
This is not medical advice, and some of these drugs or supplements I have taken or am taking.
The following is taken from a ChatGPT 5 query, and I am sure actual doctors who are members of the forum would have more insight
Summary
The drugs with the greatest danger due to narrow therapeutic range or severe toxicity in longevity communities are:
Colchicine
Dasatinib
Navitoclax
Digoxin
Lithium (at pharmacologic doses)
“These drugs can produce life-threatening toxicity with small dosing errors or interactions, making them the most hazardous compounds commonly discussed in longevity forums”
As I recall, someone in another thread said something like, “We must be careful not to off ourselves in the pursuit of longevity.”
Calling all Maraviroc users!!!
I got my maraviroc and I excitedly took 1/4 of a pill yesterday…. I was expecting to be sharp as a tack and feeling bionic… nope, nothing, nadda!!!
I said to myself ‘I guess you need to actually be doing something to feel stronger’.
So, I took another 1/4 this morning because it’s my resistance training day…. Nope, nothing, nadda… it was as hard and as miserable as it always is!
Thoughts?
@Agetron @ageless64 @Kelman anyone else?
Keep taking it for a good month or so and you should see marginal results. For me it was really good and helped a lot, but my case was unique because I lost a lot of muscle and with that, I became very weak (one year on GLP1). After couple months of using maraviroc, I was back to my normal self. My strength and energy are back to where I was before GLP1 so I’m very happy with it. But, for you or people that are already in good shape and strong I don’t think you’ll notice much difference especially early on. I intend to keep using it but I’m doing every other day now 37.5mg. As far as memory goes hard to tell but I doubt you’ll notice anything, I definitely can’t say my memory improved much, if it did it’s not easily noticeable, but my memory is relatively ok to start with, so I doubt I’d see a difference even if it helps/helped.
I see it as something that in most likelihood helps preserve muscle and strength long term as opposed to yielding immediate results (for most people) and that is excellent for our age bracket because as we age, we tend to get weaker and weaker and anything that helps would be greatly appreciated. I bought a supply of about 5 years every other day 37.5mg so I intend to keep taking it. I’ll update this post then LOL
Have not gotten mine yet. First time ever my order was seized at the border.
Go to failure. You don’t know if it’s better unless you’re going as hard as you can.
I’ll be really disappointed if it does nothing. Thought I was going to be automatically buff!
Thoughts?
Ummm give it some time to build up maybe? Lol… its not exactly cocaine with instant results.
Ok, so I just got back from my getting my yearly Body Spec dexa and I’m a little postal right now… says I lost 1.2 of muscle.
So, back to Maraviroc …
2 questions:
I was going to err on the side of caution and only take 1/4 pill 2x per week. Does it make sense to take it on training days, or does it not matter?
having said that, now that I’m feeling a little sad/desperate from this unexpected result (I’ve gained so much strength this year, more than any other year, so this was like a knife through the heart!), I’m thinking I should consider taking it more often, but I also don’t want to do anything that might hurt my health.
Aside from checking labs to make sure there is no negative effect to my liver, is there anything else anyone knows I should worry about? Is this simply still too new to take it more often if I want to avoid taking too much risk?
I’ll have a nice long chat with Claude about it, too!
Thanks for the update. I don’t know your other dexa scans, but if you lost more fat than the 1.2 of muscle(lbs I’m guessing) on your total body weight, then it’s not too bad.
Give the Maraviroc a fair trial, and adjust the dosages if you need to.
If you don’t get the results you are looking for, you could consider trying Rx medicines for muscle growth next if you have never tried any before such as testosterone and/or nandrolone - both those come in various forms as well.
I think those might be the safest bioidentical hormones for men and women to use for replacement therapy, but I am not 100% sure.
Not sure if you have had your testosterone or igf1 levels tested, but you could consider testing those if you have not.
Quit the GLP1 obviously.
Were you taking any GLP1’s during this time? If so dump it. As for Maraviroc one needs to exercise caution (obviously) but it is tolerated ok by the aids crowd taken in much higher doses and at more frequent intervals, so depending on the need (i.e. to build muscle) I would say even daily is ok (at a low dose). I would however start initially very low dose i.e. 17.5 mg or 37mg for a week or so, then move on to higher doses if desired/needed.
Thanks to all of you…
On glp1s… if I’m not mistaken, the only time these effect your muscle is if you are losing weight…
My weight is fairly stable, but having said that, I do fluctuate 2-3 pounds. I would guess that kind of fluctuation, if it doesn’t happen often (which it doesn’t… meaning, I”m not yo-yoing all the time) doesn’t have much of an effect on muscle… but I really don’t know and now that this has been shared with me, I’ll have a conversation with my new bff, Claude.
If you are on GLP1’s yes, you do lose muscle even if you don’t lose weight lol. It happened to me, and apparently different people are affected (by GLP1’s) differently but they destroyed my muscles and my strength. I lost way more muscle than fat btw, so yeah if you are taking them, I’d very much suggest you stop it but obviously it’s up to you. I think the supposed off label benefits claimed are way overblown especially for people that are not obese. I’d rather take an SGLT-2i (for off label use/benefits) if I were not obese and not pre or diabetic.
Also wondering @Beth if it was the same DEXA machine that was used for your second scan or a different one.
It is possible that two different machines will throw up two different results.
@RPS excellent point. Since my post, I have since realized, even though I intentionally went to the same place for that very reason, they have two scanners and I’m not sure which one I used last time! I’m going to see if they have it in their records.
For the record, my husband looks the same as he did last year, but he gained 8 pounds of muscle and lost 7 pounds of fat… so I think they put him on the better scanner!
Getting a dexa is not easy for me to do (over 2 hour drive away) so I’m thinking more seriously about getting the Withings Body Scan. They will come out with a new version within the next couple of months. I don’t want to spend the money, but I’m thinking at this point I should track this more often than yearly. I need to research and find out how accurately it shows real trends.
Individual error rates for dexa is 4-5%, so at 15% body fat by dexa , you could be 20% or 10% body fat . Things like hydration status, and physical activity prior to the scan will influence this. To this date, the gold standard is mri scan. My guess is that 1.2 lbs lean mass loss (not muscle loss ) is noise.
DING DING DING… I’m going with this!
Also, *bangs head on the wall, I know just enough to be dangerous… I was thinking lean mass was all muscle… but your comment had me look it up… ty…
Ok, perhaps I panicked for nothing… as I sit here downing yet another protein shake.
In your opinion, with that much variability, should I be tracking this at all if I’m doing the right things? Does this also mean the Withings body scan scale would be a waste of money too, if you know?
I see my relative lean mass and bone and it always puts me into a tailspin (I’m a small person with little bitty bones, so I’m always worried I might just vaporize in my older age)
For me, there is still value in tracking with a smart scale, so that you can tell where you’re going directionally. Not perfect, but you’ll have a better idea of where you stand over a 3 or 6 month period.
I’ve found my smart scale useful for weight loss (am I losing too much weight this week? ), and recomposition (am I adding fat, or just water weight? ).
