If it’s a placebo, it’s the best placebo I’ve ever used.
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I’ve tried three cycles of “Glow” (so named by a random med spa) with the most recent set to end in a couple weeks. A few observations:
Dosing: we are guessing here, common “Glow”
protocol simply mirrors common doses of each compound, daily or M-F:
BPC-157: 300-500mcg
TB500: 600-1000mcg
GHK-cu: 1-2mg
None of those are based on significant human studies, but they are often repeated and anecdotally positive reports (so big rock of salt with that).
TB500 (fragment) vs. TB-4 (full chain): limited data but extrapolated dosing for TB-4 would suggest dramatically higher dosing and not in context outside cardiac healing, generally for mice only. Data doesn’t support this though anecdote does.
BPC-157: dosing from mice plus a self-reported 41 person human study - not reassuring data. But positive anecdotal reports.
GHK-cu: good data and supports low risk for topical use, but limited impact topically. Injected study is minimal though many possible benefits.
KVP: some add this or replace GHK with it and call the mix Klow, I hate the names, science should not be promoted with market names derived from random med spas in 2024 when they’re just trying to sell overpriced peps they get from China.
The ontological risk of BPC and TB4 seems overstated to me, but hard to entirely discount, particularly for anyone with known risks for cancer.
My anecdote: I wish they all worked, but if they’re doing anything it’s marginal.
Wound healing is boarding on unnoticeable. Maybe a sprained wrist healed faster, maybe some good PT and strengthening would have better served me.
Skin: still more loose skin than wanted after significant weight loss. Filling in with muscle and time certainly doing the heavy work here, GHK-cu debatable impact at best.
I’ve tried a range of doses, consistently test for copper serum levels (there’s a significant risk of copper toxicity for those with Wilson’s Disease or even if heterozygous carriers), taken before and after photos, measured range of motion for sprains, recorded notes on subjective impacts … and I’m not impressed with any of the three compounds and likely won’t try another cycle. These are now just taking up space in my freezer. Might give BPC and TB500 another try if I end up with a broken bone or surgical recovery.
We all want them to work like the dramatic impacts seen from Tirz or Reta, but those well studied and successful peptides are in a wildly different league of their own while “glow” is simply not even close. In my research at least.
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For anyone interested in a skeptical take on common gray market peptides, this was a nice (if surface level) podcast:
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Related Thread:
I think there are wonder emergent substances. I take arginine plus vit C (1 in 2 days) and creatine HCL (low dose) + iron everyday; it changed my life. I do not feel any inflammation anymore, my sport resistence improved a lot, and also mental state 
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The dose is too low and not often enough.
Pretty simple.
BPC 500mcg + TB500 500mcg - per daily dose
GHK-cu 1.5 to 2.0 mg - per daily dose
The GHK-cu is optional for soft tissue healing. It has a benefit for skin but I don’t see enough evidence for ligaments, tendons and muscle.
For a chronic injury, one needs to inject every day until it’s healed.
This our maintenance dose 
for the past 2.5 years. I heal like a kid.
Most people are going to find that is an expensive dosing regimen but the cure is in the dose, why waste money on a suboptimal dose that is doing nothing? Either do it right or don’t bother.
Peptides are not magic, just because one is injecting a small amount does not mean they will work like magic. They perform based on dose, and one dose does not fit all.
Interesting
i havent seen that protocol (20u + 20u) every day. I was actually taking much more of TB (70u, which is 1750mcg)
how long taking 500mcg + 500mcg should i notice a difference in my sprained ankle (havent got an mri on that) or how long should i take to heal my shoulders ? (mri confirmed tendonites)
Units is not the best way to refer to the dose used. Units is not the dose.
Units, a measure of liquid volume, not the dose.
mg or mcg, a measure of weight, is the dose
Depending on how you reconstitute, that can change the amount of mg/mcg in the U. I don’t bother referencing U to the dose.
In 10 Units you could have 250mcg or 25mg a hundred fold increase in dose in the same volume of water.
For example our standard “shot volume” for weight loss is 50U, we change the weight of the peptide, from 2.0mg to 15.0mg per dose (8mg to 60mg per custom filled vial) we always recon this one with 2.0mL (4 shots of 50U) it makes it easy for accurate and repeatable dosing.
As far as how long it will take you to heal using a particular dose is quite dependent on you. Not just the dose. It’s like asking how long is a rope or how deep is a hole, it depends
It took 3 months to heal my old ankle (both) injuries that had not fully healed in a year.
I pulled my infraspinatus 6 weeks ago and the first time I did that 14 years ago, it took a full year to be pain free with no peptides. This time less than 3 weeks. I was amazed!
For 2.5 years I’ve been “primed” to heal by using 500+500mcg daily, with a break every couple of months.
I think one of the biggest issues with these is that we don’t truly know the proper dosing. I’m not sure how we landed on the doses that the internet universally recommends.
3 months of this dose everyday ?
maybe im paying too much for peptides in europe ?
Very true so here are a couple of PDF with animal studies, from which most of the “internet” dosing is derived.
Thymosin Beta 4 aa43 dosing use only clinical and.pdf (532.5 KB)
BPC 157 dosing use only clinical and preclinical a (1).pdf (480.3 KB)
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You probably are paying too much.
Consider that my wife and I have been doing these doses regularly for 2.5 years
That’s why I got into the business side of things so I could afford my peptide addiction LoL!
This morning I used,
- SS 31- 3.3mg - on a single dose 30 day cycle, all done this one in about 10 more days
- MOTS-c- 12mg x 2 times a day, on a 30 day cycle, all done this one in about 29 more days
- Gonadorelin - 200mcg - single dose 4 mornings a week
- BPC_TB+GHK - 500mcg+500mcg+2.0mg - singel dose daily
- KPV - 400mcg - started this on about 2 weeks ago, will stop in 2 weeks to see if it made a difference.
Tonight I will take,
- Ipamorelin + CJC 1295 noDAC - 400mcg+750mcg - 5 nights a week
- DSIP - 400mcg - 5 nights a week
Humans have a short memory for “pain”, once it stops.
I find that as I use something that may decrease pain as it heals or does what ever it does, I get used to that reduced pain state, my new normal, and don’t fully understand if it “worked” or not. When I stop something and the “pain” comes back, then I know it did have an effect.
If the pain does not come back, then I have 2 thought options,
- the “pain” source was going to heal any way, I then evaluate how long I had the pain.
- the peptide solved the root cause
Or it was the placebo effect
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So let’s keep in mind that Anti-angiogenic cancer therapy is a treatment strategy that starves tumors by inhibiting the growth of new blood vessels needed for them to receive oxygen and nutrients. These agents typically target vascular endothelial growth factor (VEGF) to stop tumor angiogenesis, often used alongside chemotherapy or immunotherapy.
Let that sink in before anyone thinks about using it daily and high doses, before we have long term safety and efficacy data from human studies.
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It’s more than the dose. You have to be active. You have to participate in your own recovery. You can’t just take this stuff and then sit on the couch. RICE is out of date.
The shoulder is a major intersection of bones, muscle, fascia, and tendons. A knot in the rotator cuff can be transmitted all the way down to the bottom of the bicep, and the whole area can be painful at once. To work on this referral pain, I like planks, the dead hang, and a massage gun. You also need to be patient. When you have a persistent injury, it feels like it will never end. But it does.
I started taking Steve’s full-spectrum TB-4 about 10 days ago. I also found some good pressure points to hit with the percussion gun. With this treatment, plus a little luck, I was pain-free today for the first time in moths. Went out for a brisk run in the cold, but a warm-up is coming soon, and I’ll be ready for it.
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Does VEGF cause cancer?
No it does not.
Tumors will themselves increase VEGF so they can grow, so increasing VEGF when you already have cancer is definitely a bad thing.
If you have cancer do not use BPC 157 and/or TB500
does VEGF cause cancer.pdf (258.3 KB)
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WoW!!
Your advice on being active during the healing process is spot on.
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How will you be sure you don’t have cancerous cells in your body right now? Are you sure that by increasing angiogenesis you won’t fuel their growth before the tumor immunosurveillance is able to detect and neutralize these cells?
I am providing a counterargument to your advice of taking large amounts of these compounds on chronic basis. I personally would not without robust human data. Using it for a limited time after injury makes more sense and would limit potential risk.
While there is no single, universally cited number for how many undetectable tumors an “average” person has, scientific studies suggest that the vast majority of people—particularly as they age—harbor dormant, microscopic, or indolent tumors that never cause illness.
Here are key insights based on autopsy studies and cancer research:
- Autopsy Findings (High Prevalence): Studies on individuals who died of other causes have shown an surprisingly high prevalence of hidden cancers. For example, some studies found that nearly 100% of individuals between 50 and 70 years old had microscopic, indolent (inactive) cancers in their thyroid glands, even though the clinical incidence is very low.
- Breast Cancer: Postmortem examinations have shown that approximately 39% of women in their 40s harbor microscopic, undetected breast cancers, despite the clinical incidence of breast cancer in this age range being only about 1%.
- Prostate Cancer: Similarly, autopsy studies indicate that about one in three men in their 40s-50s has microscopic prostate cancer, a number that increases with age.
- “Dormant” State: Many of these tumors remain in a dormant, non-angiogenic state (not growing new blood vessels) and can remain in the body for decades without progressing.
- Immune System Control: The human body generally has a robust immune system that identifies and destroys or limits these abnormal cells, preventing them from becoming harmful.
Conclusion: It is highly likely that an average, asymptomatic adult has at least one, if not several, microscopic, dormant, or slow-growing tumors that are not detected by current medical screenings.
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Looks like a lot of beneficial stuff increase VEGF.
BTW I do them all except Hypoxic Training and HBOT.
Interventions increasing Vascular Endothelial Growth Factor (VEGF) which signals the body to build more blood vessels:
- Lower-Limb Resistance Training (RT): High-intensity lower-limb RT is often the most effective method for increasing VEGF in healthy adults. Dose benefits appear above 600 METs-min/week and peak around 1950 METs-min/week.
- Blood Flow Restriction (BFR): Combining low-load resistance exercise with BFR creates a hypoxic environment that stabilizes HIF-1α, a key trigger for VEGF transcription. It is significantly more effective at boosting VEGF mRNA levels than exercise without restriction.
- Hypoxic Training: For specific groups, such as those with obesity, combining aerobic and resistance training under hypoxic conditions (e.g., altitude-simulated environments) has shown the strongest VEGF response.
- Ischaemic Training: Brief periods of blocking blood flow to a limb (either via a tourniquet or sustained isometric contraction) can stimulate VEGF.
Nutritional & Supplemental Supports
- Omega-3 Fatty Acids: Daily intake of 1–2g EPA/DHA supports VEGF production and overall vascular health.
- Vitamins & Minerals: Adequate levels of Vitamin D3 (2000–5000 IU) and Zinc (15–30mg) are vital; deficiencies in these can impair VEGF function.
- Antioxidants: Compounds like Resveratrol (100–250mg) and Curcumin (500–1000mg with black pepper) help restore and promote normal VEGF signaling.
- Nitric Oxide (NO) Boosters: Foods rich in nitrates, such as beetroot juice, enhance circulation and support the downstream effects of VEGF.
Medical & Other Therapies
- Hyperbaric Oxygen Therapy (HBOT): These sessions can enhance blood vessel formation by stimulating VEGF production during the repair phase.
- Detoxification: In cases where levels are low due to environmental toxins (like mold), supporting liver function with Glutathione or NAC may help restore normal production pathways.
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That is a great question and I agree that experimenting with BPC may have a downside.
So Monday and Tuesday I’m going to do a better review of VEGF the various types of VEGF and how it may affect cancer potential with respect to the aging process.
A couple of my thoughts/questions will be,
What is VEGF and how does it work
How is VEGF produced
Is there a normal level of VEGF
As we age, what happens with VEGF - does it increase or decrease
How many types of VEGF are there,
Is there 1 or more type more closely related to supporting cancer
What are the major drivers of cancer related to age
What keeps cancer in check,
What systems that keep cancer in check fail as we age
how important is the immune system in this process
How does the immune system perform as we age
Does BPC157 increase VEGF and which types
Is the amount of VEGF created in this process quantifiable
Does Thymosin Beta 4 increase VEGF
Is the amount of VEGF created in this process quantifiable
I have a few more questions rolling around in my head on this topic
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I’ve larned a bit here
I had read quite a few of these studies a couple years ago but with Perplexity we are able to put all that info into a more readable format. This attached PDF would have taken me weeks to put together. My analysis would have been very crude and simplistic. Now, a deep dive can be done in less than 2 hours.
VEGF is basically an on-demand system with low basal levels, that increases production based on stress type inputs.
The dose levels (500mcg + 500mcg) of what we take do not induce excess VEGF production, more like an enabler/enhancer of the age related decline in the demand system, BUT this enablement of the system would be an issue with active cancer, which would typically be treated with VEGF suppressors when it was detected.
So DrBart’s point remains unresolved, we all have cancer in us that is being dealt with, mostly by our immune system. A system that is weakening as we age, while most are doing nothing to support or improve it. Conversely some of us are ware of the importance of the immune system and are actively doing what we can to improve it.
Having a more youthful VEGF system may also have benefits.
Plus some in vivo tests indicate cancer inhibiting aspects of these 2 peptides but I would not bank on that as other things we can do have more proof.
For my personal use, I’m not as concerned now as I was when @Dr.Bart brought up the important question on VEGF increase from BPC 157 + TB500 (I use the full TB4 aa43 version) For several reasons,
- Cancer does not run in my family - one of the more important aspects of cancer.
- I don’t drink or smoke
- I’m at my ideal weight
- My diet while not perfect is keeping me strong and healthy
- I’m physically active
- My glucose is well controlled
- I support my immune system (TRIIM) and those markers are all good.
- My inflammation is very low, Lifestyle and interventions with peptides, BPC + TB4 reduce inflammation plus several other peptides I use do that as well.
- I get all my vaccines
- I pass my PSA test every couple of years.
- I pass my stool test every year.
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