I’m personally quite tired of Brad Stanfield’s non-advice. None of us have 20-30 years to wait for massive RCT of supplements or generic medicines that will probably never come.
3 Likes
Regarding Natto: There is evidence (though admittedly not perfect) that higher doses (8000FU-12000FU) slows or reversed plaque. Same with Kyolic Aged Garlic (many studies on Kyolic, look them up on PubMed).
The name of the game is to slow or stop calcification. No matter what your CAC level, if you can keep annual increases to below 15% your risk of a cardio event is almost equal to that of someone with CAC=0.
I’m taking 9000FU Natto and 2400mg Kyolic daily - plus a low dose statin. Hope this does the trick and stops or slows my CAC progression.
Here is a good overview of Natto with link to the relevant studies:
6 Likes
Nattokinase being a natural enzyme of natto, how much natto would one typically need to eat to obtain 10,000FU? I’m a relatively regular natto eater, but not a nattokinase supplement consumer. I’m confused. If this topic was covered earlier in this thread, I must have missed it, mea culpa.
2 Likes
50 grams of Natto has 1500 fu nattokinase. Older natto has less enzyme activity.
So to get 15000 you would eat a pound a day. Probably need half that, so half pound a day. That’s a lot of soy.
I used to make it, but not that crazy about the flavor. It is pretty easy to make, but it’s hard to find non GMO soy around here. They like to use the smallest seed.
2 Likes
I added 8000FU of nattokinase to my usual one tablespoon of natto per day since one tablespoon isn’t a lot of FU
1 Like
Amen !! As an ER physician, I am so tired of folks advocating for conclusive RCTs before recommending a supplement that has no downside.
6 Likes
Couldn’t agree more. I’d rather spend money on something that turns out to fail than not spend money on something that ends up working.
4 Likes
Have you observed a reduction in your LDL with this dosage? How is your CAC score?
Thanks for reminding me : I just emailed my doctor for a referral for the CAC and CIMT.
When I started Lumbrokinase on Oct 2 my baseline ApoB = 86, ApoA= 152 (not expected to improve with Nattokinase/Lumbrokinase/Serrapeptase) and Fibrinogen = 431 (expected to reduce with Lumbrokinase/Serrapeptase, but did not improve since starting Serrapeptase on 8/28/23). Will get a followup next month at the time of my CAC & CIMT.
1 Like
I have not taken the time to see if anyone else mentions this study but it may be why the enthusiasm for Natto declined in 2021. I would love to a study show otherwise but haven’t found one yet.
1 Like
Yes it was talked about here for quite a while. Then the newer study came along that said you need more like 10000fu to make it work.
Nobody has done a really good job of proving anything, but higher rates look like they are significant.
1 Like
Agree, the current evidence is that one needs more than 10,000FU daily to move the needle. What brand of Nattokinase are you all using ? I am using the Naturebell Nattokinase (2 tabs twice a day on empty stomach, total of 10,666 FU/day) from Amazon, and apparently it is 3rd party tested, and they have responded and are sending me the results. I would like to find an affordable nattokinase NSK-SD, and I thought I found one in the Vitacost product, but it is unavailable.
1 Like
What brand of Nattokinase are you all using ?
I use Nattovena from Arthur Andrew Medical (https://arthurandrew.com/products/nattovena). 4000 FU per capsule.
It’s the best option that I was able to find with my 2 criteria of (a) high per-capsule dose (FU) and (b) from a company that’s been around a while and has a good reputation.
My only concern about this particular product is whether a significant amount survives the stomach. I’ve seen studies mention that nattokinase is degraded by gastric fluids and some nattokinase products come in an enterically-coated capsule. The manufacturer’s website used to make the following claim: “Plus, it’s naturally acid-stable since it’s derived from a food source. This gives Nattovena the added benefit of not needing an enteric coating for protection against stomach acid.” I have doubts about that argument. However, I see that they’ve recently removed this claim from their site.
My planned dose of 1 capsule (4000 IU) 3 times a day, for a total of 12000 FU/day (after the Chinese study using 10800 FU mentioned earlier in this thread), initially seemed relatively high. That is, until I saw the manufacturer’s recommended dosing for this product:
- “Maintenance: Two capsules per day.” (8000 FU)
- “Increased Support: Four capsules per day.” (16000 FU)
- “Therapeutic: Six capsules per day.” (24000 FU)
2 Likes
I use this one.
1 Like
The dose of Nattokinase probably depends on weight? I’m 110lb, so 10,000 may be too much for me.
I take it sometimes to help clear out, usually during a fasting protocoll or if i feel like it can be helpfull cleancing the blood and circulatory system
Great question and I would love to know if nattokinase has similar benefits to simply eating natto.
I love natto and eat it regularly (I know that not everyone shares my enthusiasm, it’s pretty stinky stuff, 
).
My LDL and my ApoB are usually between 50-60. My Coronary Calcium Score is 0. I do not take statins or any other cholesterol lowering drugs. I take rapamycin. I cannot know for sure if natto contributes to my low LDL and ApoB. My diet has been mostly whole foods plant based for the past 15 years.
All the best trying out nattokinase. Sounds like something that would be beneficial to try.
3 Likes
Anybody here convinced that Nattokinase NSK-SD is worth the price premium ?
Assuming 12K FU/day (above 10.8K goal), my current monthly cost calculations from reputable sources, excluding taxes/shipping:
Pharmakon Nattokinase (above): $20
Nutricost Nattokinase: $20.19
Doctor’s Best Nattokinase: $22.60
Arthur Anderson Nattokinase (above): $25
Doublewood Nattokinase: $27
Allergy Research NSK-SD (Emerson Ecologics): $49.60
Vitacost NSK-SD: $52
Have a fibrinolytic day !!
3 Likes
I have been wondering the same. I eat a bunch of natto as well in my diet. I order it from Rhapsody. I know that the FU content in 50g natto is only about 100-150FU, which is very low compared to the beneficial dose of nattokinase (about 10,800FU). However, many of the same benefits have also been shown from just eating natto, which makes me wonder if it’s specifically the FU that yields the benefits or something else. Natto is very high in Vitamin K2, while nattokinase has none.
At the moment, I am having 2 tablespoons of natto daily AND taking 8000FU of nattokinase. I don’t know whether this is overkill or not.