There’s a two sided war in the TRT world when it comes to estrogen. Some say you must keep it in range with the use of aromatase inhibitors like anastozole and aromasin, while others say you want all the estrogen that testosterone converts to and that aromatase inhibitors have negative effects you want to avoid.
I’m trying to figure out if the study says what the level of estradiol these men reached but can’t find it anywhere.
I don’t think the things you listed have strong enough aromatase inhibiting properties to move the needle all that much, personally.
Great news. The FDA removed the black box warning on testosterone three days ago. Long overdue.
“Based on the results of TRAVERSE, the FDA issued new recommended changes to current labeling language for testosterone products. According to the FDA’s news release, these include adding the results of the TRAVERSE trial to all testosterone products; retaining “Limitation of Use” language for age-related hypogonadism; and removing language from the Boxed Warning related to a heightened risk of adverse cardiac outcomes for all testosterone”
The 5/25 numbers are after two months of 12.5 mg/day.
Subjectively, notable improvement in processing speed. E.g., less response lag to driving inputs. Less amplitude in irritability. I had no expectations going into this, and the changes were enough to make me go, ‘Well that’s different’.
Negatives: Pretty sure I have to pee one additional time overnight, though this doesn’t seem to be a reported effect. And it seems to have raised heart rate by several BPM. Subject to further monitoring.
Enclomiphene Citrate 20 mg daily raised my TT to 1300 ng/DL and FT (calculated, not Direct) to 94 pg/DL, but I noticed nothing subjectively. I suspect that the calculated FT may not be as accurate as a Direct FT measurement. Those are fairly high numbers so I am now trying 10 mg daily and will take another test in a few weeks that includes the FT Direct test, not the cheaper calculated version. However, as I said, so far I notice no subjective differences with these higher numbers than from my former low level of TT and below normal level of FT, but it’s still early in the process.
My India Mart search months ago did not find any pure Enclomiphene Citrate, only products mislabeled as such. Looking closely at the labels they seemed to be essentially the same as Clomid which contains both isomers, enclomiphene and zuclomiphene. You do not want to take zuclomiphene because it may affect emotions and may be feminizing and it has a very long half-life. Enclomiphene Citrate will raise FSH, LH, TT, and FT, but without feminizing or emotional effects, so the literature says. So, here is a link to the Enclomiphene Citrate I use: Enclomiphene For Sale | 99% Pure | Fast Shipping | PureRawz
I’ve heard anecdotal reports that raising testosterone with enclomiphene vs with exogenous testosterone does not result in the same user experience at equal blood testosterone levels.
I tried HCG monotherapy and felt awful on it. It more than 4x my estrogen while only doubling testosterone. Felt very emotional and anxious.
Not sure estrogen levels on TRT but I’ve not used any aromatase inhibitors and I feel fine.
I’ve not tried enclomiphene personally but I read as much as I could from user experiences on TRT vs enclomiphene, and I saw a consistent theme of people who used enclomiphene first and then went to TRT that they felt different at the similar serum testosterone levels.
I have no explanation as to why.
I have a friend who uses enclomiphene and they’ve mentioned how when using it for extended periods of time the effect seems to not be as potent. At one point they mentioned their libido completely vanished on it. Appears to change the emotional state in a way that I think TRT doesn’t do.
So Enclomiphene from India, in my experience is generally fake. There may be exceptions - but we should see an increase in LH and FSH. I’ve had many cases with Indian enclomiphene where this plainly doesn’t happen. I actually don’t recall any cases where it does what enclomiphene does. Compounded in the U.S. 100% of the time works. Now as to whether one’s testes produce testosterone in response is variable and age dependent to some degree.
I’m trending toward using gonadorelin for patients with mid range LH with low testosterone and seeing this work very well, and much more cost effectively.
For example, Belmar Pharmacy in Florida has a 500 mcg oral troche that only needs to be taken twice weekly of gonadorelin at about $2 each. Needs an Rx … but still is a great option. Injectable is similarly very cost effective - and I can get that from Mira-Vista Pharmacy in Texas.
DesertShores, look for message 133 in this thread where I gave more and better details. However, I have not noticed any subjective difference in how I feel with higher TT and FT when using enclomiphene citrate than when my TT was low and my FT was below normal before enclomiphene. However, it’s still early for me and I plan to take the FT Direct test next time, not the FT calculated version, which I think may not be accurate, since it is the FT that is the real key to any improvements. And, to complicate things even more I’ve read that there may be something called bioavailability of FT which definitely confuses me. So, all I can do is experiment to see if I can find a solution other than testosterone injections.
I did not notice a decrease in energy with low-normal testosterone, but it did effect libido and muscle mass retention on a weight loss phase. Enclomiphene restored both. Afaict, enclomiphene works as advertised.
Taken under medical supervision, clomid lowered my Total T from 244 to 185. Enclomiphene, on the other hand, went too far in the other direction, raising my T to 1200 but also increasing everything else–mood, energy, libido, and aggression. I did not like the aggressiveness. I’m now on testosterone gel, which keeps everything at a moderate but effective level.
