Not all mTOR Inhibitors Extend Lifespan and Drug Activation of AMPK Can

I regularly think about the drug portfolio that was being developed by Tornado Therapeutics when Mannick was in charge (she left a while ago). She did a presentation you can find on youtube (and which I posted on this site), wherein she presented a rapalogue with unusually focused mTORC1 inhibition that entirely spared mTORC2. She contrasted that with rapamycin which in prolonged use at higher doses does lead to mTORC2 inhibition. The rapalogue she was developing apparently could be dosed extremely high without notable side effects, unlike rapamycin. She pointed to the promise of much safer and more potent and effective rapalogues, than the original rapamycin.

The inhibitory effects were undoubtedly selective and arguably superior to rapamycin. But, the presentation never quite got to the actual outcome benefits in a fully satisfactory way. I figured they needed more time and application studies. However, I have not heard much since, leaving me dissatisfied with the lack of a progress report on the promised wonderful world of superior rapalogues. I was left hanging.

Meanwhile, the world of mTOR inhibition is very complex. One kind of inhibition is not equivalent to a different inhibition in its downstream health effects. You can have mTOR inhibition, but no longevity benefits, as the paper below says. So rapamycin is doing something special when it inhibits mTOR, which results in longevity benefits where another mTOR inhibitor does not show that benefit. That makes me rather cautious with regard to the supposedly wonderfully strong mTOR inhibitors developed in some lab (including Tornado Therapeutics) - I need to see more than “it inhibits mTOR” before I get excited - OK, that’s great, but what is the outcome - does it show specific benefit like life extension, or superior outcomes compared to rapamycin?

This also shines a skeptical light on claims for any given molecule being beneficial just “because it inhibits mTOR” - we see such claims on the regular, for example “metformin inhibits mTOR” - the immediate question becomes “so what, are there beneficial outcomes?”.

That said the mechanism is key - if say metformin does it through AMPK activation? Because drugs that activate AMPK can have beneficial effects, as the second paper describes.

Two papers that are food for thought:

Caenorhabditis Intervention Testing Program: the putative mTOR inhibitors Cinnarizine and Meclizine do not extend lifespan in C. elegans

https://www.micropublication.org/journals/biology/micropub-biology-002198

" The mechanistic target of rapamycin (mTOR), a protein kinase and master cell regulator, is one of the most validated longevity drug targets: mTOR inhibition by compounds like rapamycin has been shown to significantly extend lifespan in numerous model organisms. Here, we tested whether the novel putative mTOR-inhibiting compounds cinnarizine and meclizine could likewise increase lifespan in the nematode C. elegans , following standardized protocols from the Caenorhabditis Intervention Testing Program (CITP). Our results indicate that cinnarizine and meclizine have no effect on C. elegans lifespan at lower doses, and that both compounds exert a toxic effect at higher doses, significantly shortening lifespan."

Direct Pharmacological Activation of AMPK Extends Lifespan in Yeast, Worms and Flies

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/acel.70721

" AMP-activated protein kinase (AMPK) is a key evolutionarily conserved sensor of energy homeostasis and plays a central role in metabolic health and disease. AMPK has also been implicated in ageing; however, most in vivo drug studies rely on the use of indirect activators, such as metformin, which have complex modes-of-action, therefore making conclusions on the specific role of AMPK more challenging. Here, we demonstrate that direct activation of AMPK with the compound 991 extends lifespan in Drosophila melanogaster , Caenorhabditis elegans and Schizosaccharomyces pombe . In mice, 991 treatment induces a pro-longevity proteomic profile, highlighting the potential for translation to mammals. Overall, our study provides important proof-of-principle for AMPK as a pharmacological target with longevity benefits."

Note the emphasis on direct activation vs more unclear indirect activation as in metformin. The direct activators show unambiguously benefits in lifespan extension (which metformin by itself does not). Worth keeping in mind - it’s not just about mediated suppression or activation, because you are introducing intermediate steps which might decisively affect the outcome (as in a recent discussion of empagliflozin both upregulating and suppressing mTORC1 in different cell types - why the question of direct bonding vs indirect is so critical).

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I think there is a danger in using C Elegans as a Go-No Go screen as it does not have any BER enzymes in the mitochondria as well as other things like killing its food being an lifespan extension. In the end we know too much mTOR inhibition (which will lead to mTORC2 being inhibited) is a bad thing.

AMPK activation is another tool for encouraging autophagy and has been used in Chinese Medicine for a long time.

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Could you give some examples in Chinese Medicine? Thank you!

I have a list, but I thought I would ask claude (opus 5.5):

Quite a few TCM herbs have constituents reported to activate AMPK. The evidence varies a lot, so here they are roughly grouped by how well-supported the effect is.

Strongest evidence (including human data on metabolic outcomes)

  • Huang Lian (Coptis chinensis) and Huang Bai (Phellodendron): their main active compound is berberine. It is the best-studied herbal AMPK activator. It works indirectly: it mildly inhibits mitochondrial complex I, which raises the AMP:ATP ratio. That is the same broad mechanism as metformin. There are multiple human trials on glucose and lipids.
  • Jiao Gu Lan (Gynostemma pentaphyllum): contains gypenosides, especially damulins A and B. It is sold as “actiponin” extract and has a small human trial on abdominal fat. It is often marketed specifically as an AMPK activator.

Good preclinical evidence, limited human data

  • Ren Shen (Panax ginseng) and San Qi (Panax notoginseng): ginsenosides Rb1, Rg3 and Rh2, and especially compound K. Compound K is a gut-microbial metabolite, so the effect depends partly on your microbiome.
  • Huang Qi (Astragalus membranaceus): astragaloside IV and astragalus polysaccharides.
  • Ge Gen (Pueraria lobata): puerarin.
  • Hu Zhang (Polygonum cuspidatum): the traditional main source of resveratrol. It acts on AMPK indirectly, via SIRT1/LKB1 and PDE inhibition, and the effect depends heavily on dose.
  • Dan Shen (Salvia miltiorrhiza): cryptotanshinone, tanshinone IIA and salvianolic acids.
  • Ku Gua (bitter melon, Momordica charantia): cucurbitane triterpenoids (momordicosides).
  • Wu Wei Zi (Schisandra chinensis): schisandrin B.
  • Huang Qin (Scutellaria baicalensis): baicalin and baicalein.
  • Yin Yang Huo (Epimedium): icariin.

Weaker or more incidental evidence

  • Jiang Huang (turmeric): curcumin.
  • Lü Cha (green tea): EGCG.
  • Rou Gui (cinnamon): cinnamaldehyde.
  • Sang Ye (mulberry leaf)
  • Ling Zhi (Ganoderma lucidum)
  • Ze Xie (Alisma): alisols.
  • Gan Cao (licorice): isoliquiritigenin.

Caveats worth keeping in mind

  • Almost all of these are indirect activators. They stress mitochondrial energy production or act upstream through LKB1 or CaMKK2. None is a clean direct allosteric activator like the synthetic A-769662. So “AMPK activation” often goes together with mild energetic stress, which may or may not be what you want in a given tissue.
  • Much of the data comes from cell culture at concentrations far above what oral dosing achieves. Berberine, curcumin and ginsenosides all have poor bioavailability.
  • Berberine in particular inhibits CYP3A4 and CYP2D6. It can also add to the effects of glucose-lowering drugs, so it carries real interaction risk.
  • Whether chronic AMPK activation benefits longevity in humans, as opposed to improving metabolic markers, is still unproven. In some contexts, such as exercise adaptation and mTOR-dependent muscle synthesis, blunting the energy-stress signal could even be counterproductive.

If you want, I can pull the key papers on any of these from PubMed, for example the human trials on berberine and Gynostemma.

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Covered here: Direct AMPK Activation Extends Life in Three Species, Clearing a Path Toward Mammalian Trials

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It’s interesting… my assumption (unlike yours) was that when the founder left the company, that the company was dead. I think Krister told me that he had heard that the issue was funding (as the biotech nuclear winter in funding hit many biotech companies the past 3 years). When the lone founder moves on, I can’t think of any examples of the company continuing on. So I did not expect to hear anything else.

But… I did hear (on X) recently from someone involved with the ARPA-H doing the longevity trials, that they are testing an mTOR inhibitor from Cambrian Bio - so perhaps the IP still resides in Cambrian, and they are giving the product to ARPA-H, and if the trial is successful they will restart the company.

On the following issue: Caenorhabditis Intervention Testing Program: the putative mTOR inhibitors Cinnarizine and Meclizine do not extend lifespan in C. elegans

I really don’t care if something works in C-elegans, if its already been proven effective in mice: Meclizine / Dramamine II, Approx 15% Lifespan Increase, Another mTORC1 Inhibitor

And, with regard to Cinnarizine, I’m sure if you take 100 mTOR inhibitors that some number X will fail in c.elegans for any multitude of issues, from dosing, to other molecular issues. It still doesn’t say anything about the class of drugs in general (IMHO).

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