My DOG, My PARTNER, and ME: A Week by Week Rapalogue

Positive COVID Test

I got a positive COVID test this morning after another terrible night’s sleep and an increasingly painful sore throat. This is my first time with COVID. It feels like I’ve been hit by a truck.

I was at an event last Wednesday that included people with COVID, as I later found out, so perhaps the timing was bad luck—perhaps I effectively fought off the mild infection from the children just as I was developing COVID.

I’m not sure what effect Friday’s dose of rapamycin may have had on this illness, or if there was anything I could have done to head it off. I’m now on Paxlovid for COVID and a Z-pack for ear congestion.

To be clear, I was exposed to COVID late on Wednesday, took 5mg of rapamycin on Friday, began to feel bad late Saturday, felt increasingly bad on Sunday, and got a positive COVID test on Monday.

AgeTron, I hope I have the same experience as you–quick and easy. It hasn’t been easy so far though.

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Thank you. It’s hit me like a ton of bricks :face_with_spiral_eyes:

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If Covid makes more cells senescent then all these things will happen.

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Any more updates?

How did you determine dosage for your puppy? My guy is 6 pounds 12 year old!

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Hi Patty, I plan to post another update this afternoon. I’m trying for one a week to keep the narrative interesting and informative.

Regarding my dog’s dosage, I followed the protocol that Matt Kaeberlein is using for his “Dog Aging Project” https://dogagingproject.org/our-team/

That dose is 0.15mg per 1 kilogram of your dog’s weight (mass?), given once a week. As you know or can easily google, 1 pound equals 0.454 kilograms. My dog is 44 lbs, so I get the following:

44 lbs * 0.454 lbs/kg = 19.976 kilograms 20 kilograms

0.15 mg/kg * 20 kg = 3 mg of Rapamycin weekly

Kaeberlein is an expert in the field and thousands (tens of thousands?) of dogs are signed up for the study; thus I trust that the dosage has been carefully determined.

I hope this helps, and good luck with your pup!

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Everything you want to know about
Rapamycin for dogs is probably here in this post How Do I Get Rapamycin for My Dog?

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Week 7: post-COVID

I’m over COVID and actually feeling fantastic! Could it be that rapa helped me recover faster and feel better doing it? I’m not sure. I am fully vaccinated (4 shots) and COVID hit me like a piano falling from a second story window, but I sure did recover quickly. AgeTron, maybe it was just as you said above!

For the sake of good data, here’s how it went down for me. On my second day after exposure I took 5 mg of rapamycin, my largest dose so far. I didn’t think I’d contracted COVID, as I’d gone what, 3 years without getting it. Twenty-four hours later I started feeling very congested in my throat and sinuses. That was the third day after exposure.

If Day 0 of having COVID was the first day I felt symptoms (the third day after exposure in my case), I got progressively worse on Day 1 and Day 2. I began Paxlovid and Azithromycin (an antibiotic, a so-called Z-pack) on Day 2 after receiving an instant positive on a rapid test.

Day 2 and Day 3 were both pretty crummy for me. On Day 4 I began to feel significantly better. I felt so much better I took a COVID test on Day 4 and it was negative. On Day 5 I felt so much better. On Day 6 I took a second COVID test, as the CDC recommends two negative tests 48 hours apart as the sign that you’re truly over it, no longer contagious, and don’t have to wear a mask.

On Day 7 and Day 8 I was able to function normally, but did get tired easily, probably from sitting on my rear end for nearly a week straight. On both nights I slept hard, long, and wonderfully deep.

Today would be Day 9, I feel like a million bucks.

Apart from some fatigue early on, my primary symptom was a super-terrible, awful, and really quite excruciatingly painful sore throat, especially in one particular spot.

I now have insight into why my throat was so sore.

The Canker Sore from Hell

That’s right, in the middle of COVID, on 5mg of rapamycin, my body decided it would be an awesome time to develop a canker sore right on the back of my throat.

Allow me to share that I have never had a canker sore on my throat or tonsil ever, not in nearly 50 years of life in all of the illnesses that I can remember.

This is now my second canker sore since starting rapamycin. I do have a tendency to get canker sores; but usually while on vacation (not sure why) and even then perhaps one a year. I convinced my doctor to give me 4 or 5 some silver nitrate sticks about 10 years ago for these, and I still am using the edges of a few of them to chemically cauterize the sores to stop the pain and speed their healing.

I always get them inside my lip. Before rapamycin I would say 99% of my lifetime canker sores have been inside the lip, with the 1% being a fudge factor for something I may have forgotten.

In my Week One of rapa, on 1mg no less, I got a canker sore on the inside of my cheek. Then on Week Seven of rapa, on 5mg, I got this canker sore on I think what would technically be my tonsil, although I’m wondering if there was a second one on the same side just down my throat behind my tongue.

I now wonder how much of my sore throat pain was actually COVID and how much was this really uncomfortable canker sore. The effect was that it was extremely painful to swallow. It was worst at night when I would awaken to throat pain as many as 10-15 times a night early in COVID.

Clear Effects of Rapa Dosage

Reflecting on these first seven weeks with Rapamycin there are three very clear effects on my health and two maybe effects.

The first clear effect is that my gums continue to be really really healthy. I truly thought I had healthy gums before, but the color is less red/pink than ever, and my occasional once-a-week-ish flossing continues to have zero blood of any kind from any tooth which is unprecedented in my entire adult life.

This makes me wonder what other tissues in my body are immediately responding to rapamycin in positive directions. I’m astounded at how quickly this has occurred.

The second clear effect is that my shoulder pain continues to be gone. This was my highest hope for rapamycin. It also began some weeks ago, in truly rapid fashion. As with the first effect above, I wonder what other pain-areas might be benefitting from rapamycin.

The third clear effect is somewhat negative: the canker sores. They appear to be here to stay. I don’t know how cool I will be with a sore-a-month, or even every other month. But then again, if the sore is the price (maybe the only price?) to pay for rapid and positive health changes throughout my body… well that may be a price I’m willing to pay. Yes, I can actually say it is a price I’d pay.

The first maybe effect is that I might get slight headaches right after dosage. I need to watch this more closely. Maybe rapa is doing something to my sinuses, which historically don’t need much encouragement to go south on me. I’ll watch this more closely.

The second maybe effect is that I might feel better and sleep better. I’m not sure about this, as there are so many variables at play.

Future Rapa Dosage Plans

Having experienced so many positive effects over these first weeks, and even the negative effects, I am wondering two things about future dosage.

First I’m wondering if I need as much as 5mg a week. If 1mg gave me a canker sore in week one, and if 1mg, then 2mg, then 3mg were already helping my gums… do I need more?

Second, I’m wondering if I need a weekly dose or if I should go to a longer period. If rapamycin’s half-life is 2.5 days in the average person, my math says a 5mg dose becomes 2.5mg on day three, 1.25 mg on day five, 0.625mg on day eight, 0.3 (let’s say) on day ten, and 0.15 on day thirteen. If higher doses have unique benefits (like crossing the blood brain barrier, some say, or reprogramming your biology more effectively), and if the effectiveness of rapa is tied to the gap of jumping from essentially zero rapa to the full number on your dosage day, then perhaps a 4mg to 7mg dose should be a bi-weekly thing for me.

I haven’t decided which way I will go with this. Because a weekly dose is so convenient for my phychology (it’s Wednesday, it’s time for rapa), I’m leaning towards keeping a weekly dose, but perhaps sticking with 3mg or 4mg dose for a while to see how it affects me.

FYI, I did skip a dose in the middle of COVID. I plan to begin again later this week.

Week 7: My Dog

My sweet dog continues to get 3mg of rapa a week. As I’ve been reflecting on her behavior, I think its primary effect is to make her more responsive. This manifests as being more outwardly sociable, more likely to greet me at the door (rather than lie in a stupor on the couch), more eager to go outside, more eager for treats, more engaged with other dogs and more willing to roughhouse with them.

At times she seems unsure of what to do with herself. Like she’s feeling a burst of energy but doesn’t know what to do with it. At those times I wonder if the feeling is a good one for her. I might compare it to me drinking too much coffee. I might be more responsive to everything but is that a happy feeling?

Those moments are few though. She certainly seems happy to have the energy and inclination to say hello at the door, or to jump up on the ottoman and lay down next to me as I’m writing.

As I wondered for myself about the positive effects rapa is having on my body and may be having, I find myself musing about what effects my dog’s body and physiology may be feeling.

For example, our dog rarely brushes her teeth; never right? I wonder if this is improving her gum health, which for humans is connected to all sorts of good or ill health effects because of the continual low level inflammation or lack of it. I sincerely hope it is helping that!

She’d also showed some signs of arthritis about a year ago when we started giving her “Nutramax Dasuquin” which seemed to help. She’s done some sprinting on rapamycin which had become rare in recent years, so I hope it’s helping her joints as well.

My Partner

For about another month my partner is planning to take only 1mg of rapa a week, which doesn’t seem to have much effect on her. I am eager for her to be done with her anti-fungal toenail thing so she can increase her doses and we can see what effects it may have on her. She has some aches and pains that I would love to see healed.

Other People

On that note, do you find yourself wanting to recommend rapamycin to friends, family, or coworkers, or even acquaintances when you hear of their significant health challenges? I do.

I wish it was a more mainline treatment so I didn’t feel like a ogre suggesting that people attempt off-label self-dosage with organ transplant meds obtained in India because, “like, it could really be good for you.”

Thus far I’ve managed to keep my mouth shut around everyone but my uncle who has some benign tremors. I sent him a link to a rapamycin.news article and he said he’d take a look when he had a minute. I assume he didn’t, since he never mentioned it again.

Ah well, if rapamycin is really as good for us as it seems, it’ll catch on eventually. It does feel good to be on the vanguard, though, doesn’t it?

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Sir, Is you also taking Finestride 1 mg , minoxdil with rapamycin. Pls reply

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Hi Dutacet, welcome to the forums. yes - the writer of this Thread @HigoMe33 states in the first post that he’s taking the following in addition to his rapamycin regimen:

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Hello, sorry for the delay. I have unpleasant side-effects from Finasteride. This led me to use less and less until I was taking a quarter of a pill daily (0.25mg).

These side effects had nothing to do with rapamycin, as they began long before I started rapa.

I have since begun to take 5 drops of pumpkin seed oil daily, from a post on this forum that included research that pumpkin seed oil blocks the generation of DHT, like finasteride. Supposedly it would not have the same sexual side effects, but thus far it actually seems the same. (Subdued orgasm, less ejaculate, lowered libido, possibly fewer nighttime erections.)

I am considering stopping finasteride/pumpkin seed oil for these reasons.

Yes, I continue to take minoxidil. I have settled into half a pill daily (1.25mg, I believe) taken before bed for convenience. This is easy to do and has no side effects that I notice. I expect to continue this indefinitely.

For the record, I am aware of no reports of drug interactions between rapamycin and finasteride or minoxidil. Hope this helps.

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Hey HigoMe33 - My urologist prescribed a daily 5mg sildenafil for urinary health 1 1/2 years ago. I do that and the pumpkin seed oil gel pills - 1000 mg and 5mg finasteride, and 5mg minoxidil daily. no issues or side effects on my ability to perform.

Good to go 24/7.

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I was taking .25 mg of finasteride but had to stop. It literally made my testicles hurt. It was a dull but medium-intensity pain that wouldn’t go away until I stopped taking finasteride. Everyone’s biology is different!

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Exactly… maybe try Pumpkin seed oil?

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Weekly Update: 6mg

Ten days ago I upped my dose to 6mg at a 10-day cycle. I’m happy to say I felt great all 10 days! No mouth sores, headaches, or anything else negative to speak of. Next week I see my dentist. I’m curious to hear his thoughts and those of my hygienist.

My partner did notice a few things:

My Partner: 2mg

We were sitting around the dinner table when my partner said, “I think I’m a lot more talkative when I take rapa. Like I’m chatting everybody up all day long.” I wonder if this is related to that sense of euphoria that some people say they feel when they dose. For example, some people have said they don’t dose in the evenings, because they have a hard time falling asleep afterwards.

I feel like I’ve noticed the chattiness too.

I usually take my dose on Wednesday mornings around 7:30am and I have a major morning meeting at 10:30am. I swear I’m more talkative at those meetings when I’ve taken a dose of rapamycin, sometimes to the good and sometimes not. Have you noticed becoming more social or more talkative on your dosing day? I’d be curious to hear.

A secondary effect my partner is wondering about has to do with slowed healing from bruises.

Three days before her last dose she had a cortisone shot for a stubbornly painful joint. While the doctor was administering the injection, he moved the needle around in her joint, saying this would bring blood to the area and speed her recovery. Apparently it hurt like the dickens.

The next day (day two), her joint was bruised, as you might imagine. On day three, the bruise was the same as day two. On day four, she took 1mg of rapamycin; the bruise was slightly diminishing. On day five, the bruise was suddenly 3-5 times bigger than it had been! This large bruise did not increase any further, but remained that size as it slowly faded over about 10 days time.

She also had a second experience regarding bruising.

While some cousins were visiting she got shot in the shins a few times with a nerf pellet gun. She was playing with them outside and the whole thing was silly and part of a game. It was Nerf after all. But the next day she had two pretty sizable perfectly round bruises on her legs with a little welt in the center. We think it must have been the pellets. It’s now been 12 days and they’re still visible, though fading. That’s longer than ever for bruises for her.

This is something we’ll watch. She finishes her anti-fungal course this week so she’ll be able to start working up to goal of 4mg weekly.

The Dog: 3mg every week

Nothing new to report on the dog. She’s doing great, happy as a clam, healthy, energetic, and social. We’ll continue the rapa and continue to watch.

Me:

I picked up another throat thing from the kids I work with. It’s tame but came with a little laryngitis. When this passes I’ll take another 6mg dose and start the 10 day clock again!

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Scooter, is in the TRIAD ( Test of Rapamycin in Aging Dogs ) study portion of the Dog Aging Project. He is on a placebo or rapamycin and has been for 7 weeks. I was certain he.was on the placebo until one day I was throwing a ball for him and I was use to seeing him slow down after a good number of chases. When he did not tire as I expected I suspect he maybe on the med.
Note: My wife started by increasing the dose 1mg per week she is up to two. I have been taking 5mg/wk for a couple months now and have not noticed any thing worth reporting.

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Hi there! Glad you and your dog are doing so well.
Can I ask: for your dog, are you doing anything in regards to using an “enteric coated capsule” to bypass the stomach acid, and increase availability? I just found out that it’s possibly a big deal (if you’re not using the Rapamune, but a generic), but am confused as to what exact type of capsule, and at what time to give before or after a fatty meal.
Best, Jeff

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Hi Jeff, welcome to the forums. The problem with bioavailability is not with the generics or rapamune, its with the compounded pharmacy capsule versions of rapamycin. More details here: New Peter Attia interview w/Matt Kaeberlein, inferior bioavailability of encapsulated rapa

Most of us just give our dogs the same generic rapamycin that we take ourselves and it works fine.

Generally you want to have the fatty meal just before, or with, the rapamycin. Details are here: Improve Bioavailability of Rapamycin (2)

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Hi there! Glad you and your dog are doing so well.
Can I ask: for your dog, are you doing anything in regards to using an “enteric coated capsule” to bypass the stomach acid, and increase availability?

hey there, thanks so much for the response! Since it’d been a little while since the last thread on the ‘enteric capsules’, I just wondered if there was any consensus yet?
(Unfortunately, the only place I can get Rap from currently is via a compounding pharmacy, so am just looking for best way to make it go the extra mile for my dog).
Again, thank you for taking the time to message.

I think most people just avoid the compounding pharmacy versions of rapamycin, but I recommend you read more here: Bioavailability of Rapamycin From Compounding Pharmacy

But - you probably want to talk to the pharmacy, explain the issue to them and get their guarantee that the capsules are designed with enteric coating because of the well-known bioavailability issues.

You can also read up here how some people (not what I would recommend) are using rapamycin powder and encapsulating the powder: How many are making their own solutions from powder?

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I echo everything RapAdmin said.

We give our dog the same pills that we’re taking. We purchased them from India, as many here have done. They arrived in 2-3 weeks without any trouble. There’s a thread on trusted Indian suppliers which I believe is easily found through the “RapamycinFAQ” link found at the top of the page in a desktop browser.

The pills made for humans have the coating to make it through the stomach. I’m not sure how a compounding pharmacy accomplishes the same, but the general consensus is that stomach acid will decimate the Rapamycin and leave your body with little to absorb.

The fatty meal is not necessary. The consensus is that it increases bioavailability by about 30%. Humans tend to use the fatty meal as a way to get more Rapamycin into the bloodstream, meaning you can take fewer pills for the same level of absorption.

For this reason we don’t give our dog a fatty meal with rapa. She gets what she gets through her normal food, plus a little “spray treat” we found in the pet section which is like a whipped cream sprayer but it dispenses something gooey that dogs like. This helps hide the pills.

Good luck and best wishes. Our dog is doing great. She’s 12 and has been on rapa for around 8 weeks.

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