Is there any studies on animals where we see lifespan extension where the researchers also have tried to infect the animal with an virus or bacteria to see if the immune system has been lowered? I remember in one podcast with Matt Kaeberlein he mention that the lab animals live in a almost infection free environment. This is why he thinks the dog study is good because it’s done outside the lab.
PS I know about the Joan Mannicks short study on humans but I’m searching for a study which shows lifespan extension combined with infections.
I don’t think I’ve ever seen any. They might be out there - but I haven’t come across any.
I’m still not totally clear on what you’re looking for too … it seems like you are trying to find a lifespan study in mice with rapamycin, where the mice are exposed to a more “natural” environment where there are likely to be more infectious agents and bacteria, etc. that they would see in their regular environment (more like what humans experience on a daily basis) - is that what you are looking for?
I can see the value of a study like that… to gauge the level of immune system suppression that is so great that it negatively impacts the survival curve that you would expect with rapamycin.
Its an interesting idea… you might look through the mice studies that have been done with rapamycin to see if anything is at all close to what you are thinking:
it seems like you are trying to find a lifespan study in mice with rapamycin, where the mice are exposed to a more “natural” environment where there are likely to be more infectious agents and bacteria, etc. that they would see in their regular environment (more like what humans experience on a daily basis) - is that what you are looking for?
Yes, right on spot! Because if we look at calorie restriction and infections we can see decreased lifespan. Here is one study on mice.
If we also look at extended fasts which trigger also inhibits mTOR than different studies have found that during the fast the immune system is weakened but after the fast the immune system is improved to a better state than before the fast.
If we also look a really tough exercise we see that it can weaken the immune system and increase the infection risk. Here is one study on that
When it comes to extended fasting I usually advocate that not to practice it when you are sick or during periods when the risk of getting sick is high. But also not practice it when the body needs to heal from a for example a fracture or a wound because then the body needs more anabolic processes to be triggered to heal instead of triggering to much of the catabolic processes.
I will keep digging and post here if I find anything of interest.
Here is a quote from a study pointing out that rapamycin in organtransplant doses can delay wound healing.
Based on our protocol, CNI was typically used for the first 6 months after HT to avoid delayed wound healing that could occur with earlier introduction of SRL (=Sirolimus)
I also found this study on rats
In conclusion, we found that RAPA treatment affected all steps of the wound healing process by decreasing the inflammatory cell number, angiogenesis, and myofibroblast proliferation, so the wound healing process was delayed and consequently the tensile strength of the wound decreased.
Because calorie restriction also delay wound healing than probably it is good to pause even longevity dose of rapamycin if the body needs to heal.
This is also good aligned with what Dr Robert Kotloff is saying about how LAM patients are treated when it comes to surgery and transplant. See video below around 38:25 in the clip
I just took my first shingles vaccine a few weeks ago. Stopped rapamycin almost 2 weeks prior, started again a week later. Good / Strong response from the vaccine (felt like the flu was coming on the next day), but then the following day was good again.
That guideline you posted is for daily, immunosupressive doses of rapamycin, not weekly dosing like we do.