Thanks very much Jason!
You feel good on one injection of test c per week?
Taking rapa and two doses of test c proves a scheduling challenge for sure.
But Im only doing 130-150 per wk.
Ive been able to add some muscle but am worried a little about rapa and test c conflicting and not getting the best possible result
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Who prescribed you the rapamycin ?
This is why a good physician would take a detailed H&P, PE and baseline laboratory tests before prescribing rapamycin. You would be surprised what a simple CBC can uncover.
Context also matter, personally I think rapamycin for anti-aging indication would be a horrible idea for young professional athlete - typical training session of 20 hours per week - they already get a ton of m-tor inhibition via exercise.
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Since you are biochemist, I would love to hear the mechanism of action of rapamycin “purifying” the tissues and what exactly are those “toxins” being released. Any reference to studies elucidating this process would be appreciated as well.
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Dr Bart,
Not going to happen because it does not happen. Next will be cup full of EVOO for liver detox (oh look at the green tinged poop its liver enzymes…ah no its undigested EVOO because you drank a bucket full overwhelmingly the gall bladder and created a fast transit situation. Activated charcoal is great if you have just consumed a toxin/poison but outside that it does not discriminate what it absorbs its what makes it great in garden soil (bio char) it becomes a nutrient organism sink.
Could you explain mtorc1 inhibition from heavy resistance workouts that are followed by proper protein intake and freq. I always have seen resistance workouts as stimulating mtorc1 S6 insulin etc as well as protein intake especially leucine. Seems to be a multitude of research supporting this. Is there some sort of intitial dip during the workout? Any scientific links explaining it?
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Hey Dutch…I only take one TRT injection per week (and it is enough), so I space it out with my rapamycin dose. Don’t want them fighting benefits. So rapamycin then 3 days later TRT… 3 days later rapamycin…etc.
Been doing this method the whole time because I started TRT one year before starting rapamycin. Now on rapamycin 3.5 years.
Hope this helps. Will pm send you pic from gym tonight… already had my steak… 2mg rapamycin and fresh red grapefruit juice next.
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Well, I hardly have the time to write a treatise on cellular and biochemical metabolism here. Sometimes it’s helpful to take the big view as well as common sense, instead of diving deep into technicalities. Generally everything that happens in the body is a chemical/biochemical reaction.
Substrates +/- enzyme/acid/base = products (and possibly wastes).
Cellular wastes generally would be excreted through blood, lymph, skin, lungs. However, with our polluted environment and non-food additives, the cells often get “things” which don’t fit into any substrate pathway, so they encapsulate them for “storage” until they can get instructions on what to do with them. When I was at Immunex devising the process development to purify Genetically engineered cytokines from E. Coli, the bacteria would produce millions of copies of the proteins and then encapsulate them into “bags” we called inclusion bodies. The cytokines had no purpose in the bacteria, so they were just “stored.” Our cells do the same with things that cannot be cleared from the body via normal processes.
Apoptosis is cellular death. If a cell has outlived its function or is storing too much, it’s not contributing to the health of the tissue or organism. So any “wastes” of apoptosis, are the broken down cellular components and anything else stored in the cell.
If you have time to read a lot of papers, here are two good refs:
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/epdf/10.1002/9781119432463.ch1
https://www.amazon.com/Switch-Metabolism-Intermittent-Fasting-Protein/dp/1982115408/ref=sr_1_8
The latter book is how I learned about rapamycin to begin with.
Hope that helps.
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Thanks Jason, much appreciated
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Dr Bart,
I’m 66.5 years old
No one prescribed rapa, I bought Rapacan (sirolimus) on my own after speaking with two doctors who suggested it could help with insulin resistance. One endo I saw recently prescribed metformin.
I’ve had many labs done the past two years, blood and major organs all good, except for some insulin resistance. Started clean dieting and resumed rapa about three weeks ago.
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Peter Attia has 3 podcasts with Matt Kaeberlein diving deep in to all rapamycin and mtor related. Over 6 hours total, and it’s incredibly insightful. I am in process of listening to it again, and probably do it again and again until I can recite it word for word.
Here is good paper that explores exercise in the light of breast carcinoma and its effects on mitigating cancer via different pathways including mtor.
New Insights into the Role of Exercise in Inhibiting mTOR Signaling in Triple-Negative Breast Cancer - PMC.
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Thank you I will read it and listen to the podcast. I have no issues with the effectof rapa it was only resistance workout causing mtorc1 inhabition that took be by surprise. I can certainly see it helping mantain mtorc1 pustile nature vs age/ systemic inflammation hyperactivation.
I have been trying to research if rapa along with workouts and modified fast 1x per day food intake will not only supress mtorc1 over the active period but actually prevent the decline or even restore the pustile nature of healthy mtorc1. As you know we get increasingly blunted mtorc1 signalling from protein intake with age. More so then with intense resistance excercise. I have been lookingbat research on the effects of weight trained adpated seniors if they mantain the health mtorc1 protein activation sensitivity.
My hypotheses is we can actually reverse the hyperactivation of mtorc1 vs just pharmaceutically supressing it over the AUC. I sure wish we could see Mtorc1 activity when on rapa of varying plasma concentrations when the subject uses heavy resistance weight lifting along with proper protein supplementation. I wonder if those strong triggers allow a pulse of mtorc1 and if so how long does it stay elevated and the magnitude compared to when there is no rapa in plasma. I have a great deal of experience in the science of performance based nutrition, pharmacological, and exercise but much of that has been focused youth young to mid aged adults but not with the effects of aging at 50+ years. Not much until the last year beyond TRT reestabilishing younger GH release profiles.
I had just never considered a inhibition of mtorc1 from resistance workouts as m6 focus had always been on the peaks from a muscle hyperthrophy focus.
Thank you again.
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Took the AgelessRx blood panel to establish a baseline in late December and hit the ground on January 1 by adding rapa (4mg/wk), acarbose and doubling my atorovastatin to 10mg (in addition to amping up exercise and eliminating all as much added sugar as possible). Had the blood work repeated at the end of Feb … amazing result with in all the markers that were ‘off’. Most significantly: Apolipoproteinb dropped from 108 to 86, total cholesterol dropped from 249 to 188 and fasting glucose from 116 to 104. The only one that did not improve was A1c …it actually went up from 5.7 to 5.8 (I attribute that to December’s residual). Also dropped 10# over 2 months …slowly. Have just upped my rapa to 6mg/wk. Certainly no way to attribute the improvements to any one factor …but plan to stay the course, and add additional resistance training to the mix. (Age 74)
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We know that rapamycin tricks the MTOR protein that senses nutrition into thinking that your body is fasting/starving and it goes into the starvation protocol and catabolic autophagy.
Post dosing rapamycin you might want to have a few capsules of activated charcoal to help clear cell toxins.
Just got this product. You are suppose to take 2-3 after a meal to clear toxins. Had my rapamycin yesterday - just took a capsule.
Fasting Activates Autophagy
During fasting, the process your cells use to eliminate waste products, called autophagy, is activated. Through autophagy, you are cleaning out the “junk” when you are fasting. This process appears to be critical to the survival of every cell in your body and has been linked to a greater lifespan.
Here’s the best part, there’s even a natural supplement to get even more out of your detox, help your cells clean themselves, and receive the most benefits from intermittent fasting. And it comes in the form of another fad-turned-lifestyle choice: activated charcoal.
If you are new to fasting, it is particularly important to take products that can assist your body’s waste removal process by trapping and escorting toxins from your body.
The reason for this is because when you first start fasting, your body may not be able to handle the toxins released into your bloodstream from your body fat.
During a fast… use activated charcoal: This type of charcoal traps toxins in your gut and prevents your body from absorbing them. It can help you avoid gut pain while fasting, and it also reduces your hunger cravings.
Charcoal tablets or capsules
Take by mouth with a glass of water. Follow the directions on the package label or use as directed by a health care provider.
CHARCOAL (CHAR kole) is a dietary supplement. It is used to absorb gases in the stomach that cause stomach gas. Do not use this supplement to treat poisonings or overdose. The FDA has not approved this supplement for any medical use.
This medicine may be used for other purposes; ask your health care provider or pharmacist if you have questions.
COMMON BRAND NAME(S): Charcoal Plus DS, CharcoCap, CharcoCaps Anti-Gas
This medicine may bind to other medicines or dairy products in the stomach. Do not take any other medicines for at least 2 hours before or after taking this medicine. Do not eat or drink milk, cheese, or other diary for at least 2 hours before or after taking this medicine.
Herbal or dietary supplements are not regulated like medicines. Rigid quality control standards are not required for dietary supplements.
This medicine may also interact with the following medications:
acarbose
aripiprazole
birth control pills
carbamazepine
dapsone
digoxin
olanzapine
phenothiazines like chlorpromazine, mesoridazine, prochlorperazine, thioridazine
phenytoin
pindolol
some herbal medicines or dietary supplements
theophylline
ursodeoxycholic acid
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Yes, I take this often! You can also use Chlorella and Spirulina tablets.
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I would be interested in hearing from those who are taking rapamycin, acarbose and Ramipril. Specifically any impacts on blood pressure.
I am taking all three of those along with Nebivolol. I started with Ramipril about three and a half years ago, initially at 1.25mg per day rising to 2.5mg per day. My average BP before starting was only around 130/80 but I would often wake up at night with pounding in my ears which I could only relieve by standing up and doing breathing exercises. Often as soon as I would lay down again in bed the pounding would return. My GP suspected nocturnal hypertension and that’s how I started on the low dose Ramipril.
I started Acarbose in April 2023 initially on 25mg per day and built up to 50mg twice per day. I started Rapamycin in May 2023 on 1mg every two weeks gradually rising to 5mg with GFJ every two weeks. I have now backed off to 2mg with GFJ every two weeks. I added Nebivolol in December 2023 mostly for the supposed benefits of increasing HRV, initially at 1.25mg per day for two weeks and then 2.5mg. I tried going up to 5mg but then started to get symptoms of hypotension so immediately dropped back to 2.5mg. My average BP now is 110/60 and I don’t get the nocturnal hypertension symptoms anymore.
Ideally, I would like to come off the Ramipril so long as my BP doesn’t increase too much so I intend to gradually reduce the dose over the next two months.
I haven’t noticed any negative interactions from these drugs while being on all of them. Additionally I take 80mg Atorvastatin, 10mg Ezetimibe, 1g Metformin and 0.5mg colchicine daily (except on grapefruit days when I drop the Atorvastatin to 60mg). I am happy to answer any questions you can think of if I can.
Can you explain in layman’s terms how charcoal acts as a senolytic?
The doctor probably thought that it was a bacterial infection rather than viral. Could it explained the doxy script?
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Do you take charcoal immediately after taking Rapa or wait couple hours or so?
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Take rapamycin at night 11pm 2 mg and fresh GFJ … next morning two 780 mg charcoal capsules after breakfast 7:30 am… 2 more again after dinner 8pm. Several glasses of water all day long. Clears toxins.
Stomach feels fine.
Just started. Makes sense.
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I take charcoal in powder form. Mix it with water and take when in sauna and after, three times a week.
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