What actually triggers Ketosis?

#1

I am a very skinny guy on day seven of total fast, afraid I am still not in ketosis (no acetone breath) and lose muscle. Thus, I wonder what actually relyably triggers ketosis:

  1. Since the body turns excess sugar into fat, it surely has the option of turning it back into sugars rather than ketones, right??? So even starting to eat keto does not necessarily start ketosis?

  2. Why would adding external ketones trigger making internal ones? I do not see the mechanism. Or is it the brain getting ketones that helps the switching towards ketosis?

  3. Could the 6 ml of MCT oil I just took convince my body that switching to ketosis now is a good idea? I mean, it just forces the liver to make some ketones, but is this going to switch toward making ketones out of dietary fats generally, why?

  4. I got no access to no lab tests, so please do not recommend that. I am really rather interested in

A) whatever other signs of ketosis there are (besides acetone breath), and

B) what helps triggering ketosis (for all those whose bodies perhaps just do not easily switch for whatever reason, especially for the first time)

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#2

You can get inexpensive ketone test strips which test for ketones in urine.
You can also get (in the US) a ketone monitor for under US$100.

During a prolonged fast, the body can enter a catabolic state, where it breaks down tissues for energy. This begins consuming muscle as fuel.

The extent to which the body consumes muscle depends on several factors, including the duration of the fast, the individual’s metabolic state, and their body’s ability to adapt.

Once a body begins to breakdown muscle into amino acids it creates glucose via gluconeogenesis, particularly for cells that require glucose (e.g., red blood cells) which throws you out of ketosis.

Entering ketosis involves shifting the body’s metabolism to primarily burn fat for energy instead of carbohydrates. Key steps and factors that help the body enter ketosis include:

Significantly Reduce Carbohydrate Intake

• Lower your carbohydrate consumption to around 20–50 grams per day. This reduction depletes glycogen stores in the liver and muscles, forcing the body to turn to fat for energy.

Increase Healthy Fat Intake

• Increase consumption of healthy fats such as avocados, olive oil, nuts, seeds, and fatty fish. Fats become the primary energy source in ketosis. MCT oil a very good choice.

Moderate Protein Intake

• Consume protein in moderation. Excess protein can be converted to glucose through gluconeogenesis, potentially delaying ketosis. That said, most people don’t consume enough protein and one needs to balance intake with demands for muscle maintenance and building.

Fasting

• Intermittent fasting or longer fasting periods can accelerate glycogen depletion and prompt the body to switch to fat metabolism, but stay war of entering a catabolic state.

Exercise

• Physical activity, especially aerobic or endurance exercise, helps deplete glycogen stores more quickly, aiding the transition into ketosis.

Stay Hydrated

• Proper hydration supports the body’s metabolism and helps prevent side effects like headaches or fatigue (often called the “keto flu”).

Electrolyte Balance

• Consuming enough sodium, potassium, and magnesium can help combat keto flu symptoms and maintain energy levels.

Track Progress*

• Use tools like urine strips, blood ketone meters, or breath analyzers to monitor ketone levels and ensure you’re in ketosis.

It may take 2–7 days to enter ketosis, depending on your body’s metabolic state, diet, and activity level.

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#3

This is excellent advice through and through. The only thing I have to add: add even more fat, at least 150g of most any kind. My typical macros look like P/C/F = 85/45/250 grams/day and I achieve 2 mmol ketosis regularly. I can eat up to 70g carbs and maintain ketosis, as long as I exercise. I use Keyto and occasional ketone blood strips to check every week or so.

Check out

for a nice review of healthy nutritional ketosis and its benefits.

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#4

so you do not know the answer to the question posed, why tell a guy on the seventh day of total fast to cut down on carbs???

I now have keto flu, but still do not know what actually triggers ketosis. Does the liver decide by itself whether to turn fat into glucose or ketones? On what basis?

#5

I did not tell you to cut down on carbs.
I provided an explanation as to why, even after fasting, you may not have entered ketosis.
Unless you have tested that you have entered ketosis, self diagnosing that you have “keto flu” could keep you from seeking medical treatment for some bad outcome from your fast.

You seem unwilling to do research to find information readily available to anyone and now you attack those for providing information.

You could readily google or ask ChatGPT what causes ketosis.
I suggest you do some research to form clearer and better questions.

From ChatGPT:

Ketosis is a metabolic state in which the body uses fat as its primary source of energy instead of carbohydrates. This occurs when carbohydrate intake is very low, causing the body to shift to burning fat for energy. The process produces molecules called ketones, which serve as an alternative energy source for the brain and other tissues.

Causes of Ketosis

  1. Low-Carbohydrate Diets (e.g., Keto Diet):

• When carbohydrate intake is reduced (usually to less than 50 grams per day), glycogen stores in the liver and muscles are depleted. The body begins to break down fat into fatty acids and ketones for energy.

  1. Prolonged Fasting or Starvation:

• During fasting, the body exhausts its glycogen reserves and shifts to burning fat for energy, leading to the production of ketones.

  1. Uncontrolled Diabetes (Diabetic Ketosis or Ketoacidosis):

• In people with type 1 or advanced type 2 diabetes, a lack of insulin prevents glucose from entering cells, forcing the body to use fat for fuel and produce ketones. This can lead to diabetic ketoacidosis (DKA), a dangerous condition with very high ketone levels and acid buildup in the blood.

  1. Increased Energy Demands:

• During prolonged physical activity or endurance training, the body may enter ketosis due to depleted glycogen stores.

  1. Certain Medical Conditions:

• Some metabolic or hormonal disorders can promote a ketogenic state, including rare conditions like glycogen storage diseases.

  1. High-Fat, Moderate-Protein Diet:

• Consuming a diet high in fats and moderate in protein (but very low in carbohydrates) stimulates ketone production, as protein in excess can be converted to glucose through gluconeogenesis.

Nothing turns the fat back to sugar.

Not certain. I never need to add ketones. Ask ChatGPT.

No. Your body switches to burning fat when you significantly reduce carbohydrate intake.

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#6

“Ask chat gpt” LOL, has science education and critical thinking declined this much already? Look, I know all that for years already. The question is, what actually triggers ketosis. With autophagy, much of the above is the same, but it is mTOR and all of that which triggers autophagy rather than ketosis, and spermidine or rapamycin for example can help pulling that trigger. What is it for ketosis? Chat gpt does not know, so thus we all do not know? My friends, let me tell you all, I know stuff Chat gpt does not know, and also, stuff it will not tell you!
We scientists find out, then comes Chat gpt. The times scientists ask AI instead, well, soon, but not Chat gpt.

BTW, after 7day fast and one day with 11% protein and only 6% carbs, rest fats, and vigorous anabolic exercise plus run, I am in ketosis, I feel great, and I have the keto flu now, I don’t need a test for this.

#7

I consume about 12 grams of Beta -hydroxybutyrate (BHB) daily. About 5grs each of the potassium and magnesium salts and a gram each of the calcium and sodium salts. So I have quite a bit of ketones in my system as shown by simple cheap urine strips. I’m not producing it from fat, but still its in my system floating about and my brain, muscle or organ cells can use it as they see fit. Its kind of a lazy man’s way to ketones and undoubtably less healthful than fasting, But still I think ketones are conceptually a good idea, so I have them floating about for my various cells to partake of, as needed.

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