Next estrogen that extended male mice lifespan 16 alpha-hydroxyestradiol - does anyone knows anything about this?

#1

According to Richard A Miller (NIA ITP), 16 alpha-hydroxyestradiol extended male mice lifespan the same as 17 alpha estradiol (15-18%) and shortened female mice lifespan by 3%
Not published yet from what I know

It seems like female hormones (estrogens) may be good for males and bad for females - exactly opposite what many people (and doctors) say

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#2

Can the public buy it?

#3

.1mg $682.00 that is .1mg

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#4

Where did you hear this from? Is there a podcast somewhere that he mentioned this in?

#5

I don’t remember the exact video - it was a video with Richard A Miller on youtube or some podcast - he said it had similar effect to 17 alpha estradiol on males and shortened lifespan of female mice, but results are not published yet

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#6

Even at that rate it says this:

Low stock, delivery determined at time of order.

or this:

CIL will contact you with availability.
#7

Alpha estradiol improved healthspan but apparently not lifespan for female mice so this is REALLY different if it actually hurts females.

#8

From Peter Attia Drive we have this:

Insight into what Rich though was going on with 17âș-estradiol, and how badly they were wrong

  • Mike Garratt collaborated with a guy named Mo Jain to look at steroids in the tissues of mice treated with 17âș-estradiol (among other things), and he noticed something really interesting
    • He found two steroids that were members of the estriol family (not estradiol) that were elevated at least 20-fold in males that got the drug
      • [reported as estriol‐3‐sulfate and 16‐oxoestradiol 3‐sulfate, metabolized from 17âș-estradiol]
      • And they were not elevated in females at all
    • It was a male-specific production of estriol when 17âș-estradiol was given, and we knew it was sex specific because if he castrated the males before the drug, you didn’t see the estriol production
  • The conversion from estradiol to estriol depended upon testosterone or some other testicular hormone
  • So Rich thought estriol was going to be the one that is going to work in both males and females
  • The dataset is 90% complete, and we’ll probably start writing it up in a month or two when we have 90% of the mice dead, but we had 50% of the mice dead
  • We’ve presented at meetings, and the data says that that guess was partially right and partially wrong
  • The hydroxy version of estriol is great for males
    • It’s actually at least as good as 17âș-estradiol
    • We won’t know until we have the last few deaths, but it’s terrific
    • That was a good guess: you don’t need 17âș-estradiol because the estriol works terrific
  • However, we thought it would work in females, and it is the first drug we’ve found that diminishes lifespan in females
    • So the idea that it would work to benefit females was wrong
    • It is for mysterious reasons harmful in females

To be clear is this straight estriol (E3)?

  • It’s 16-hydroxy estriol

Why did you pick 16-hydroxyl estriol as opposed to 4-hydroxy, 2-hydroxy, or just pure estriol?

  • Rich doesn’t know the answer, we could ask Mike Garratt
  • Maybe it was commercial availability
  • Maybe it was prior studies of toxicity in mice
  • Mike has his reasons, and Rich read the application three years ago and doesn’t remember what specifically led him to suggest this compound

The female mice that are dying at an accelerated rate, is there anything specific about the manner of death?

  • We don’t know yet; we haven’t done any necropsies
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Bicalutamide/spironolactone or other antiandrogens to suppress testosterone? Chemical/Physical Castration?
#9

Starts around 1:43:30

In this episode

December 4, 2023

SCIENCE OF AGING

#281 ‒ Longevity drugs, aging biomarkers, and updated findings from the Interventions Testing Program (ITP) | Rich Miller, M.D., Ph.D.

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#10

If anyone can find any of the talk abstracts from meetings or even the actual video any such conference talk please do share

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#11

Thanks for sharing that interview with Rich Miller. Was the reason why pure estriol was not used ever discovered? It would be very helpful to know if there were any serious issues with it. Any additional info on this would be greatly appreciated.

#12

@Luminary Not sure on my end. Would also love to hear the answer if anyone knows anything.

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#13
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#14

estriol-3-sulfate and 16-oxo-estradiol-3-sulfate are intermediates in the conversion from 17-alpha-estradiol into 16-alpha-hydroxyestriol


17-alpha-estradiol is a pain to get, so just get the above.

#15

Buy how to dose for men?

#16

“in mice 17α-estradiol was increased 3-fold to 14.4 mg/kg/day”
convert to a human dose

my guess is that the dose is within an order of 2 of the ideal dose of 17-alpha-estradiol

Bryan uses 8 mg of 17-alpha estradiol every week

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