My second melatonin thread (bc first is overcrowded)

please do not post much if at all here

I am going to run a google deep research and everything on this b/c it might have the highest effect size
also doris loh says phase condensation/separation

if melatonin is REALLY helathy and even pro-GSF fluid clearance at very high doses [see doris loh] then how does coadministering it with sucralose change how healthy it is b/c sucralose increases aging rate

Amazon.com: Horbäach Melatonin 40mg Complex | 360 Fast Dissolve Tablets | Adult Extra Strength Supplement | with Chamomile and Ashwagandha | Vegetarian, Non-GMO, Gluten Free : Health & Household [this in particular]

Melatonin at larger doses (10 mg/day) has been seen to lower inflammatory markers, like CRP and TNF-alpha, in clinical trials

Doses of 10 mg/day also have been seen to improve cardiometabolic risk factors like blood pressure, cholesterol, and blood sugar

Melatonin might protect against microplastics by stimulating antioxidant defense and promoting waste clearance via the glymphatic system in the brain (PMID: 32368984; PMID: 38805828)

A lot of glymphatic system activity happens during sleep with melatonin (PMID: 36917314; PMID: 35316766)

https://youtu.be/K2S7vbJZ8kY

Graph: PMID: 38334678

Impact of Sucralose on High-Dose Melatonin’s Health Benefits

Melatonin’s Anti-Inflammatory and Metabolic Benefits

High-dose melatonin (beyond typical 1–3 mg sleep doses) has demonstrated notable anti-inflammatory effects in humans. For instance, a clinical trial using 6 mg of melatonin at bedtime found significant reductions in inflammatory markers – high-sensitivity C-reactive protein (CRP), tumor necrosis factor-α (TNF-α), and interleukin-6 – compared to placebo . A 2021 meta-analysis of 31 trials likewise concluded that exogenous melatonin produces anti-inflammatory effects, significantly lowering pro-inflammatory cytokines such as IL-1, IL-6, IL-8, and TNF-α (though effects on CRP were less clear) . Since chronic, low-grade inflammation (“inflammaging”) is a driver of aging, melatonin’s ability to quell inflammatory signaling suggests a potential anti-aging benefit via inflammation reduction.

Beyond inflammation, melatonin also favorably influences cardiometabolic risk factors. Doses around 5–10 mg per day have shown improvements in blood pressure and blood lipids. For example, several placebo-controlled trials report that bedtime melatonin (2.5–5 mg) can modestly reduce nocturnal blood pressure in hypertensive patients . In patients with metabolic syndrome, melatonin has improved lipid profiles – one long-term study in coronary patients using 10 mg nightly observed significant decreases in total and LDL cholesterol . Similarly, in type 2 diabetics, 10 mg/day of melatonin for 3 months improved glycemic control and insulin resistance (lowering fasting glucose and enhancing insulin sensitivity) compared to lower doses . These metabolic benefits – better blood pressure, cholesterol, and glucose levels – all correlate with a healthier aging trajectory (since cardiovascular and diabetic risks typically increase with age). Notably, melatonin is remarkably safe even at high doses: trials in healthy adults using 20 mg, 50 mg, or even 100 mg of melatonin nightly reported no serious adverse effects aside from mild transient drowsiness . Some clinicians (such as researcher Doris Loh) even experiment with hundreds of milligrams daily for potential mitochondrial and anti-aging benefits, although such extreme dosing is still experimental. In summary, high-dose melatonin acts as a broad-spectrum anti-aging agent – reducing inflammation, improving metabolic markers, and generally countering many physiological risk factors associated with aging.

Melatonin, Sleep, and Glymphatic “Brain Cleansing”

Melatonin’s role in deep sleep and brain detoxification may be one of its most important healthy-aging mechanisms. Melatonin is the body’s natural sleep signal; it promotes the onset of slow-wave sleep, during which the brain’s glymphatic system works to clear waste. The glymphatic system is essentially a nightly “brain-washing” process where cerebrospinal fluid (CSF) flows along the brain’s blood vessels to flush out metabolic waste products (such as amyloid-β plaques) into drainage pathways . This waste clearance is maximal during deep sleep – the time when melatonin levels peak. Researchers have proposed that the high melatonin levels at night directly facilitate glymphatic clearance of neurotoxic debris . In other words, melatonin not only helps you sleep, but it helps your brain self-clean during sleep.

Figure: Schematic of the glymphatic system*. During sleep, cerebrospinal fluid (light blue) circulates from peri-arterial spaces into the brain tissue, mixing with interstitial fluid (ISF) and flushing out waste (brown particles) which is then drained along peri-venous spaces out of the brain. Aquaporin-4 (AQP4) water channels on astrocyte end-feet (orange squares) facilitate this fluid exchange. This “brain cleansing” is most effective in slow-wave sleep. Melatonin’s nocturnal rise promotes the deep sleep stages when glymphatic clearance is maximal* .

Notably, melatonin levels drop dramatically with age, and this may impair the efficiency of glymphatic brain-cleaning in older adults . Some studies indicate that melatonin supplementation can reverse aspects of this age-related decline in brain clearance. In animal models of Alzheimer’s disease (AD), extra melatonin has been shown to reduce amyloid-β accumulation by enhancing its removal from the brain, and high-dose melatonin even prolonged survival in those models . Correspondingly, preliminary trials in humans hint that melatonin use might improve neurocognitive health (for example, reducing “sundowning” confusion in dementia patients) . Melatonin is also a powerful neuroprotective antioxidant: it can directly neutralize free radicals and reduce oxidative damage in brain cells. As a modern illustration, melatonin was found to protect cells from microplastic-induced toxicity. In vitro, melatonin markedly ameliorated oxidative stress in human red blood cells exposed to bisphenol-A (a plastic component), reducing lipid peroxidation and preserving glutathione levels . Likewise, in a 2024 rodent study, melatonin supplementation counteracted the hormone-disrupting and inflammatory effects of chronic microplastic exposure – the melatonin-treated rats had far less adrenal gland damage and oxidative stress than rats exposed to microplastics without melatonin . Taken together, these findings suggest melatonin promotes “cleaner,” healthier brain function as we age: it enhances the removal of waste (via sound sleep and glymphatic flow) and shields the brain from oxidative/inflammatory damage. These properties make melatonin a compelling geroprotective (aging-delaying) molecule in high doses.

Sucralose’s Potential Pro-Aging Effects

Sucralose, on the other hand, is an artificial sweetener that may counteract some of melatonin’s healthy-aging effects. Many high-dose melatonin supplements (including the 300–400 mg formulas) use sucralose as a sweetening agent. While sucralose is calorie-free and often considered inert, recent evidence suggests it can disrupt metabolism and promote inflammation – changes that generally accelerate aging processes rather than slow them. In fact, the World Health Organization in 2023 went so far as to advise against using non-sugar sweeteners for weight control, citing possible long-term risks like higher rates of obesity, type 2 diabetes, cardiovascular disease, and even increased all-cause mortality in habitual consumers . In other words, large epidemiological studies have linked artificial sweetener use to the very chronic diseases that shorten lifespan, casting doubt on their “healthiness.”

A key concern is sucralose’s effect on inflammation, one of the hallmarks of aging. Paradoxically, while melatonin reduces inflammatory signals, sucralose may increase them. Clinical research has found that consuming amounts of sucralose comparable to a few diet sodas can activate pro-inflammatory pathways in the body. For example, in one trial overweight adults drank three sucralose-sweetened beverages daily (total ~200 mg sucralose per day) for 8 weeks. The result was a significant rise in inflammatory gene expression in their white blood cells, compared to a control group . (Notably, standard blood inflammatory markers didn’t spike in that short timeframe, but the genetic “switches” for inflammation were clearly turned on.) Even acute exposure can have an effect: a separate experiment showed that a single 48 mg dose of sucralose (roughly the amount in one can of diet soda) led to elevated levels of inflammation-related mediators within 15 minutes in young, healthy volunteers . Such findings suggest that sucralose is not biologically inert – it can provoke the immune system in subtle ways. In the brain, too, sucralose might have pro-inflammatory actions. A 2024 cell study on human microglial cells (the brain’s immune cells) reported that long-term low-level exposure to sucralose caused a cascade of neuroinflammatory changes: increased activity of the NLRP3 inflammasome (which drives inflammation) and higher release of IL-1β (an inflammatory cytokine), along with signs of oxidative stress (elevated 8-OHdG and lipid peroxidation) . The sucralose-treated microglia showed molecular evidence of ferroptosis – an iron-related cell death pathway linked to neurodegeneration . In plain terms, sucralose might make microglia hyper-reactive and prone to an inflammatory, self-damaging state. Chronic, low-grade inflammation in the brain is thought to contribute to cognitive decline, so this is a worrisome sign that sucralose could accelerate brain aging at the cellular level.

Sucralose may also undermine metabolic health, which is tightly intertwined with aging. One concerning effect is on insulin resistance. Normally, melatonin helps regulate blood sugar (some research even shows melatonin can improve insulin sensitivity in diabetics), but sucralose appears to do the opposite. In a controlled trial, healthy individuals who consumed sucralose daily (at about 15% of the FDA’s acceptable daily intake) for just 14 days developed significantly higher insulin resistance than those who did not . In essence, their bodies became less responsive to insulin, a metabolic change that often precedes diabetes. This matters for aging because insulin resistance is a known risk factor for many age-related conditions – not only diabetes, but also heart disease, cognitive impairment, and even cancer . By promoting insulin resistance, sucralose could be tipping the body towards an earlier onset of metabolic disorders, thereby potentially shortening healthspan. Additionally, population studies have found links between long-term artificial sweetener use and weight gain, fat accumulation, and strokes , further suggesting that regular sucralose intake can undermine metabolic and cardiovascular health over time.

Perhaps most striking is emerging data suggesting artificial sweeteners might age the brain faster. A recent 2025 study in Neurology tracked over 12,000 middle-aged adults for 8 years and found that those who consumed the most artificial sweeteners had a 62% faster decline in cognitive (memory and thinking) abilities compared to those who consumed the least . This degree of cognitive decline was equivalent to what might normally be seen after an extra 1.6 years of aging in the brain . Importantly, sucralose was one of the sweeteners commonly consumed (along with aspartame, saccharin, etc.) in this study. While correlation isn’t causation, the data controlled for many factors and still pinpointed a significant association between high artificial sweetener intake and quicker cognitive aging . In essence, heavy use of sweeteners like sucralose was linked to people acting “older” on cognitive tests than their actual ages. The mechanism isn’t fully clear, but it might involve some combination of the inflammation and metabolic dysregulation discussed above. The takeaway is that sucralose, especially in large chronic doses, could subtly speed up the aging process – particularly in the brain and metabolic systems.

Combined Effects: High-Dose Melatonin with Sucralose

When considering a 300–400 mg melatonin supplement that contains sucralose, we essentially have a mix of one substance that strongly fights aging processes (melatonin) with another that might accelerate certain aging processes (sucralose). The question becomes: how do they interact, and what is the net effect on health and aging?

First, it’s worth noting that the amount of sucralose in a single melatonin pill is relatively small – often on the order of a few milligrams to improve taste. This is far less than the 200 mg/day used in some of the studies above. Thus, any negative effects from sucralose would likely be milder in the context of a melatonin supplement than in someone chugging multiple diet sodas daily. Melatonin’s dose, by contrast, is extremely high (300+ mg is orders of magnitude above what the body naturally produces at night, and even above typical pharmacological doses). Such a high melatonin dose will flood the system with melatonin’s beneficial signals: antioxidant activity, anti-inflammatory gene expression, improved sleep depth, etc. In fact, at 300–400 mg, melatonin may have pharmacodynamic effects that we don’t fully see at 10 mg – potentially including enhanced mitochondrial function and gene regulation (high-dose melatonin can enter cells in large amounts and even concentrate in mitochondria, combating free radical generation at the source, as Doris Loh and others have hypothesized). So the pro-melatonin, anti-aging “push” is very strong here.

On the other hand, even a small amount of sucralose could cause a momentary counter-signal. For example, ingesting sucralose with the melatonin pill might trigger a transient release of insulin or an incretin hormone (some studies suggest sweet taste alone can provoke hormonal responses). If taken at night, this is somewhat unnatural – normally during sleep you wouldn’t have insulin spikes. There’s some evidence that melatonin itself can reduce glucose tolerance at night (part of normal circadian rhythm), so adding sucralose might further perturb nighttime metabolic balance. Over time, nightly sucralose could contribute to slight worsening of insulin sensitivity, which melatonin’s presence might only partially mitigate. Similarly, if sucralose activates inflammation-related receptors in the gut or brain, it might send a minor pro-inflammatory signal at the same time melatonin is trying to suppress inflammation. High-dose melatonin will likely suppress systemic inflammation quite a bit (as noted, it can lower TNF, IL-6, etc.), but the sucralose could locally induce some inflammatory mediators (say, in the gut lining or in microglia). The net result might be that melatonin’s anti-inflammatory effect is a tad less potent than it would be without sucralose. For instance, if 300 mg of melatonin alone could have lowered your CRP by a certain amount, the formulation with sucralose might lower it slightly less, or require a bit more time to achieve the same effect, due to the counteracting influence. This is speculative, but consistent with the idea that sucralose adds friction to melatonin’s benefits.

From an “ultimate aging rate” perspective, one could argue the combination still leans heavily in favor of melatonin’s positive impact. Melatonin at high doses will be working to slow several aging mechanisms (reducing oxidative damage, enhancing nightly cellular cleanup, maintaining healthier daily rhythms for organs, etc.), which should, if anything, decelerate the aging process in those domains. Sucralose, in the small doses included, might accelerate some aging mechanisms, but likely to a much smaller degree. For example, consider brain aging: melatonin might improve sleep quality and waste clearance enough to reduce your risk of neurodegenerative changes (effectively making your brain age more slowly), whereas a tiny bit of sucralose might have a negligible impact on brain inflammation in comparison. In systemic terms, melatonin could lower nighttime blood pressure and cortisol, which are good for longevity, while a pinch of sucralose might barely move the needle on your long-term metabolic health (especially if your overall diet is otherwise low in sweeteners). Therefore, taking 300–400 mg melatonin with sucralose is still likely to confer net anti-aging benefits – certainly more so than not taking melatonin at all – but the benefit might be slightly less than it would be in an ideal world where that melatonin had no sucralose. If high-dose melatonin were theoretically going to “roll back” your biological clock by some amount, the sucralose could minutely chip away at those gains. As an illustrative (but hypothetical) estimate: perhaps nightly high-dose melatonin (with good sleep) could slow your brain aging so that cognitively you function like someone 5 years younger; a bit of daily sucralose might then counteract a small fraction of that, say 0.5–1 year of that advantage, by subtly promoting inflammation or insulin resistance. You’d still come out biologically younger than your baseline, just not as much as you could without the sucralose.

In short, co-administering sucralose doesn’t reverse melatonin’s healthy effects, but it can be seen as an unnecessary opposing force. Over a long timescale, even mild pro-aging influences (like habitual sweetener use) can compound. The cognitive aging study, for example, implies that what seems like a trivial daily habit might translate into measurably faster decline a decade later . For someone investing in high-dose melatonin specifically to reap health and longevity benefits, it makes sense to minimize any counterproductive factors. Thus, from a longevity standpoint, one might want to choose a melatonin formulation without sucralose or any artificial sweetener – especially since melatonin itself doesn’t taste bad when swallowed in a capsule. If a sweetener is needed (for a liquid or chewable form), a natural alternative like a tiny amount of stevia might be preferable, as it hasn’t been as strongly linked to aging-related changes (though research there is ongoing too).

To summarize the best estimate: a 300–400 mg melatonin supplement will strongly engage anti-aging pathways, and the addition of sucralose likely only slightly erodes those benefits by promoting inflammation/aging pathways to a minor extent. Your overall “ultimate aging rate” on melatonin+sugar-free sweetener would probably still be slower than normal (thanks to melatonin) – but with sucralose in the mix, the slowdown could be a bit less pronounced than it otherwise would be. In practical terms, you’d still gain the lowered inflammatory markers, improved sleep-driven brain clearance, and cardiometabolic improvements from melatonin, which are big wins for healthy aging . Just be aware that the sucralose is an avoidable downside. If possible, opt for pure melatonin or formulations without artificial additives, so that you’re not inadvertently speeding up one aspect of aging while trying to slow down others. After all, the goal of taking high-dose melatonin is to maximize health and longevity – and eliminating sucralose is a simple step to ensure you’re getting the full longevity advantage of your melatonin regimen .

Sources: High-dose melatonin trials and meta-analyses ; Melatonin effects on blood pressure, cholesterol, and blood sugar ; Melatonin and glymphatic waste clearance ; Melatonin protection against microplastic/BPA toxicity ; WHO guidance on artificial sweeteners and health risks ; Sucralose-induced inflammation and insulin resistance findings ; Artificial sweeteners and accelerated cognitive aging .

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