@desertshores hope you are correct about the studies being ‘only suggestive’. I’ve been using some ACB=3 drugs (doxylamine,dicyciomine) for years for help with sleep! Tried meclizine last night; mixed results thus far.
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@jjrap1 ’m with you! I’ve been on doxylamine myself for years after working nights off and on for 20 years ruined my sleep.
blsm and jjrap1, I’ve tried doxylamine, but prefer diphenhydramine (benadryl). For me, doxylamine is more effective, but diphenhydramine doesn’t seem to give me any of the bad side effects I get from doxylamine the day after (grouchiness, foggy thinking, sleepiness).
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Maybe supplement with phosphatidylcholine or another choline supplement in the morning.
It will increase acetylcholine levels and possibly mitigate the effects of the anti-cholinergic
sleep aids. Before I retired I took anti-cholinergic sleep aids for decades as do millions of Americans. I am still looking for definitive proof that they cause memory problems or if they do what is the absolute as opposed to the relative risk. Since this information is so hard to find after the hundreds of millions of doses of sleep aids, I believe the absolute risk is minimal. I am open-minded about this. If someone can prove me wrong please do.
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@Jay, I avoid benadryl these days because I read of the association with prostate issues; they say it can ‘substantially worsen symptoms of bph’. Used it for years when I was younger.
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In todays’ new cycle:
jjrap1, I’m not an expert, but my understanding is that all anticholinergic antihistamines aggravate BPH symptoms. If you have any type of reference that indicates benadryl is worse than doxalymine, please post it. I’d like to read it. Thanks.
@Jay, as you say,both are anticholinergic antihistamines, but compare the urinary side effects for the two at e.g. ehealthme.com (and elsewhere).
jjrap1, Could you help me out just a little more? I went to ehealthme.com and typed in “benadryl urinary side effects”, followed by “doxalyamine urinary side effects”. There was a lot of reference to urinary tract infections with both antihistamines, but I couldn’t find the effect on BPH symptoms. I’m a little slow. So, could you pinpoint the link more closely to the information I should read?
Here is the link I’ve been using: Antihistamine Decongestant Effects On Benign Prostate Disease.
“The older, first-generation antihistamines, such as diphenhydramine (Benadryl, Nytol, Sominex), brompheniramine (Dimetapp), chlorpheniramine (Chlor-Trimeton) and doxylamine (Vicks NyQuil, Alka-Seltzer Plus) are effective in relieving allergic symptoms. However, they cause drowsiness and weaken the ability of the bladder to expel urine. The drowsiness itself may allow a man to sleep through the signal to urinate, which can allow the bladder to become overdistended and contribute to acute urinary retention. The first-generation antihistamines contain a warning for men with prostate disease.”
The link and quote above likely are not giving the more precise information you’re trying to provide.
Thanks.
Based on personal experience:
I am not sure that they actually affect BPH, but they can make it more difficult to urinate, especially at night if you have BPH. Mainly it reduces peeing flow rate.
The following sleep aids have been shown to be helpful if you want to avoid anti-chlorogenic sleep aids
Valerian root, chamomile tea, magnesium, passionflower, and glycine.
Personally, I have found valerian root and glycine to be very effective in reducing the time to fall asleep. These are as effective, IMO, as most over-the-counter sleep aids. Trazadone is also probably safer than anti-chlorogenic sleep aids and is effective in relatively small doses, i.e. 50mg.
@Jay, go to Doxylamine succinate vs. Benadryl - eHealthMe, scroll down to the common side effects links for both, then scroll through the 100 or more entries for benadryl (vs. the 2 for doxylamine) until you reach the Urinary side effects. But consider the source; I’m not a HCP/chemist, etc. My personal experience using both has been that doxylamine is less problematic in this regard than benadryl (n=1).
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Have nothing data driven to tease out a positive cognitive signal on my taking alpha-GPC. It definitely did not make anything worse that I can tell. In my tracking notes I have some comments about feeling a bit more wired, which is commonly reported. I didn’t take it for athletic improvements, nor did I notice any effects, per your 2nd question.
Rapalogs are not active site inhibitors — that is, they don’t bind to the site where mTOR would bind to a substrate and block it from interacting. Instead, it’s an allosteric inhibitor: it binds to an accessory protein (FKBP12) which when alters FKBP12’s interactions with the FKBP12-Rapamycin-Binding domain of mTOR proper (FRB) , altering mTOR’s shape in a way that inhibits mTORC1 kinase activity to a varying degree depending on the substrate and phosphorylation site.
On the other hand, rapamycin-bound FKBP12 does not bind to mTORC2 at all, so it has no direct effect on its activity.
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Hm. This survival curve is attributed to ITP, but Richard Miller (principal of ITP, profile in upper right-hand corner) presented at the National University of Singapore (NUS) last December, and his meclizine survival curves look much less impressive:
I also agree with several other posters that the apparent short- and especially (apparent) long-term risk of cognitive imipairment should rule out self-experimentation without a lot more data on this question.
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I think the presenter for the first data set said it was from a single site, not necessarily from the three ITP sites that Richard Miller’s more recent presentation would likely show.
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I think I’m giving meclizine a pass. Not worth the potential disastrous side effects.
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I’m 28 and take rapamycin.
As you stated you’re not going to feel autophagy, mitophagy, decrease in cell proliferation etc. So I’m hoping this will slow the aging down, even though I don’t feel anything. I’m sure alot of positive things are happening in my body so I’ll continue rapamycin
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Sleep disturbances drive risk of dementia. What’s the most common OTC remedy for insomnia? Diphenhydramine. Some allergic conditions are also associated with greater risk. Again, same class of drugs are primary OTC treatments. So it’s good practice to take epidemiology like this with a grain of salt, especially when the drugs in question are also treatments for possible cofactors. The causal relationship might just as well be working in reverse.
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