Dermo-electroporation for Aging Skin Health and Rejuvenation

RapAdmin · October 23, 2025, 2:31am

It’s interesting… perhaps it depends on how you ask the question, also. I tried a slightly different question, trying to be as specific as I can. I believe that Radiesse needs to get at least down to the Mid-dermis for collagen stimulation.

It seems, from your experience, and the Instagram post you cited, Radiesse can at least be delivered sub-dermis. The open issue is how deep it goes, and does it work as a biostimlator at that level that it does get to.

So, Here is one of my attempts on Google (just using the standard google search bar):

Prompt:

can hyperdilute radiesse be delivered successfully to the mid-dermis or deep dermis in people using dermo-electroporation?

Response:

Delivering hyperdilute Radiesse to the mid- or deep dermis using dermo-electroporation (DEP) is not feasible. The calcium hydroxylapatite (CaHA) microspheres in Radiesse are far too large to pass through the temporary micro-channels created by DEP technology.

Here’s a detailed breakdown of why this method is unsuccessful:

CaHA particle size: The CaHA microspheres in Radiesse range from 25 to 45 microns in diameter. This is a very large size for a particle to be delivered transdermally (across the skin).
DEP delivery mechanism: DEP works by using electrical pulses to open temporary, microscopic channels in the skin to increase permeability. This allows for the non-invasive delivery of water-soluble molecules.
DEP delivery limits: Even advanced DEP systems can only deliver substances to a maximum depth of 3 to 5 mm, targeting micro- and macro-molecules up to 800,000 Daltons. The solid, particulate CaHA microspheres in Radiesse are much larger than the molecules that DEP can transport.
Radiesse injection method: For hyperdilute Radiesse to reach the mid-to-deep dermal layers, it must be injected using a cannula or needle, which physically places the substance into the desired depth. This is how the treatment is performed in clinical practice.

Conclusion
While dermo-electroporation is an effective, non-invasive method for delivering certain active ingredients like hyaluronic acid or peptides into the dermis, it is completely unsuitable for delivering a particle-based product like hyperdilute Radiesse. For Radiesse to be successfully administered to the dermis, a medical professional must use a needle or cannula injection.

Another Question Approach with Google Search AI results:

Prompt: can hyperdilute radiesse be delivered successfully using dermo-electroporation?

Response:

Yes, hyperdilute Radiesse can be delivered successfully using dermo-electroporation

(DEP). DEP is a needle-free system that is used as an alternative delivery method for substances like hyperdilute Radiesse, which is known for its ability to stimulate collagen production.

How dermo-electroporation (DEP) works

Dermo-electroporation is a non-invasive, powered drug-delivery system that increases the permeability of the skin.
It works by applying a controlled current to the patient’s skin, which temporarily opens water-based channels in the skin.
This allows both micro- and macromolecules to be absorbed into the deeper layers of the skin, including the hypodermis and muscle membranes, without the use of needles.

Another Question Approach with Google Gemini:

Prompt:

can hyperdilute radiesse be delivered successfully to the mid-dermis or deep dermis in people using dermo-electroporation?

Response:

Based on the available information, the use of dermo-electroporation (DEP) to successfully deliver hyperdilute Radiesse (a Calcium Hydroxylapatite or CaHA product) specifically into the mid-dermis or deep dermis is a complex question with some conflicting or limited data.

Here’s a breakdown of the key points:

Hyperdilute Radiesse:
- It is a formulation of the Radiesse dermal filler diluted with saline and often lidocaine, resulting in a thinner, more spreadable solution.
- It is typically used as a biostimulator to promote collagen and elastin production, often targeting larger areas and improving overall skin texture and laxity.
- The standard, current clinical practice for delivery is injection (usually with a cannula) into the dermal layer or different depths within the dermis depending on the treatment area, not via a non-invasive device like electroporation.
Dermo-Electroporation (DEP) Technology:
- DEP systems are FDA-cleared for the local administration of ionic drug solutions into the body as an alternative to injections.
- It uses controlled electrical pulses to create temporary micro-channels in the skin, enhancing permeability and facilitating the transdermal delivery of substances.
- Some DEP device manufacturers claim they can infuse high-weight molecules, including certain dermal fillers (like RHA Redensity), neurotoxins, or Sculptra (another biostimulator), to depths of 3.0 to 5.0 mm into the dermis.
- A depth of 3.0 to 5.0 mm would generally be considered within the range of the deep dermis or extending into the subcutaneous tissue.
The Conflict/Uncertainty:
- While some DEP manufacturers claim the capability to deliver high molecular weight components (like fillers or biostimulators), and even specifically mention delivering dermal fillers, there is a lack of widespread, independent, peer-reviewed clinical studies specifically confirming the successful, effective, and uniform delivery of the calcium hydroxyapatite microspheres in hyperdilute Radiesse to the intended mid-dermis or deep dermis layer using DEP.
- One source reviewing the use of electroporation for another injectable moisturizer (a hyaluronic acid complex) noted that most studies show increased uptake in the epidermis, not the deep dermis, which is the correct layer for the product’s maximum benefit. This highlights a potential limitation of transdermal delivery devices compared to direct injection.

Conclusion:

While DEP technology is marketed as capable of delivering various high-weight molecules into the dermis up to $5.0 \text{ mm}$, direct, definitive evidence confirming the clinical success and efficacy of delivering hyperdilute Radiesse’s CaHA microspheres to the deep dermis using dermo-electroporation is not readily available in standard clinical literature. The primary and widely accepted method for delivering hyperdilute Radiesse remains injection with a needle or cannula.

Another Question Approach with Google Gemini:

Prompt:

can hyperdilute radiesse be delivered successfully using dermo-electroporation?

Response:

The short answer is: Probably not effectively, based on the current scientific understanding and clinical practice.

Here is the detailed explanation:

The Challenge of Particle Size

Hyperdilute Radiesse works because of its active ingredient: Calcium Hydroxylapatite (CaHA) microspheres . These are microscopic particles suspended in a gel.

CaHA Microsphere Size: Radiesse microspheres typically have a diameter of 25 µm to 45 µm (micrometers) .This is a relatively large particle size.
Dermo-Electroporation (DEP) Mechanism: DEP works by using controlled electrical pulses to create transient, aqueous pores (nanopores) in the stratum corneum (the skin’s outermost layer) and lipid bilayers. This enhances the delivery of substances through the skin.
The Barrier: While DEP is highly effective for delivering small molecules (like certain peptides or vitamins) and some macromolecules (like hyaluronic acid, which can be broken down to smaller fragments), delivering solid microspheres in the 25-45 μm range is likely beyond the capability of the temporary pores created by DEP. The pores created by electroporation are typically on the nanometer scale.

Clinical Practice vs. DEP Claims

Standard Clinical Protocol: The universally accepted and evidence-based method for delivering hyperdilute Radiesse is injection (using a needle or cannula) directly into the desired layer of the skin (subdermal or deep dermis). This method physically places the CaHA microspheres where they can contact fibroblasts and stimulate collagen.
DEP Device Claims: Some DEP device manufacturers claim they can deliver a wide variety of macromolecules, even mentioning fillers or biostimulators, to the deep dermis (up to 3-5 mm). However, there is a significant lack of independent, peer-reviewed clinical studies specifically demonstrating the successful delivery of solid, large CaHA microspheres with DEP to a depth that would produce the collagen-stimulating effects seen with injection.
Depth Limitation: Studies on similar large-molecule delivery via electroporation sometimes suggest that most of the uptake concentrates in the epidermis , failing to reach the crucial deep dermis where the fibroblasts need to be activated by the CaHA particles. The collagen-building effect requires direct contact between the CaHA microspheres and the dermal fibroblasts.

In summary, the sheer size of the CaHA microspheres makes their successful transport through the microscopic, temporary channels created by dermo-electroporation highly improbable, and this approach is not supported by established clinical guidelines for Radiesse.

Another Question Approach with Anthropic Claude:

Prompt:

can hyperdilute radiesse be delivered successfully to the mid-dermis or deep dermis in people using dermo-electroporation?

Response

Based on my search, I cannot find any published evidence or established protocols for delivering hyperdilute Radiesse (calcium hydroxylapatite) using dermo-electroporation. Here’s why this appears to be problematic:

Standard Delivery Methods for Hyperdilute Radiesse

Hyperdilute Radiesse is traditionally delivered using needles or blunt-tipped cannulas through injection techniques AAFE PubMed Central. The standard approach involves superficial injection using microboluses, tunneling, and/or fanning techniques to place the diluted material in the dermis PubMed Central.

Dermo-Electroporation Technology

Dermo-electroporation uses controlled electrical pulses to create temporary channels in the skin, allowing transdermal delivery of ionic drug solutions at depths of 3-5mm Regenomedix DEP Medical. The technology can deliver molecules greater than 800,000 Daltons Regenomedix.

Key Compatibility Issues

There are several fundamental problems with combining these technologies:

Physical Properties: Radiesse contains calcium hydroxylapatite microspheres that are 25-45 microns in diameter suspended in a gel carrier Medscape Reference PubMed Central. These are physical particles, not ionic solutions that dermo-electroporation is designed to deliver.
Mechanism Mismatch: Dermo-electroporation is designed for water-soluble ionic drug solutions Regenomedix DEP Medical, whereas Radiesse is a particulate suspension that requires mechanical placement.
Lack of Evidence: I found no published studies, clinical protocols, or manufacturer guidance supporting this combination approach.

Clinical Recommendation: Given the lack of evidence and the incompatibility between the particulate nature of Radiesse and the ionic solution requirements of dermo-electroporation, this combination should not be attempted. Hyperdilute Radiesse should be delivered using established injection techniques with needles or cannulas as supported by clinical evidence.

Another Question Approach with Grok:

Prompt:

can hyperdilute radiesse be delivered successfully using dermo-electroporation?

Response

Overview of Hyperdilute Radiesse and Dermo-Electroporation

Hyperdilute Radiesse refers to calcium hydroxylapatite (CaHA) filler (the active ingredient in Radiesse®) mixed with saline and/or lidocaine at a ratio of 1:2 or higher, transforming it from a volumizing agent into a biostimulatory treatment. This dilution reduces viscosity, allowing superficial injection to promote neocollagenesis (new collagen production), elastogenesis, and improved skin quality, elasticity, and firmness without significant volume addition. It is commonly used for skin laxity, fine lines, crepiness, and cellulite on areas like the face, neck, décolletage, arms, and thighs.

Dermo-electroporation (also known as dermoelectroporation or DEP) is a non-invasive transdermal delivery technology that uses controlled electrical pulses to create temporary micro-channels in the skin’s lipid bilayers. This enhances permeability, enabling the delivery of macromolecules (up to 800,000 Daltons) into the dermis and hypodermis (up to 5 mm depth) without needles. Unlike traditional iontophoresis, it avoids pH adjustments or electrolysis and is FDA-cleared for medical drug delivery. It is often paired with serums, hyaluronic acid, or peptides for rejuvenation.

Can Hyperdilute Radiesse Be Delivered Successfully via Dermo-Electroporation?

Based on available evidence, there is no documented clinical use, study, or guideline supporting the successful delivery of hyperdilute Radiesse via dermo-electroporation. Radiesse, even in hyperdiluted form, is explicitly designed and approved as an injectable subdermal implant (FDA-cleared for injection via needle or cannula). Its CaHA microspheres (25–45 microns in diameter) are suspended in a carboxymethylcellulose gel carrier, which requires mechanical deposition into the subcutaneous or dermal layers to achieve therapeutic concentrations and stimulate fibroblast activity.

Key reasons this combination is unlikely to be successful or standard practice:

Delivery Mechanism Mismatch: Dermo-electroporation excels at transdermal diffusion of ionic solutions, water-soluble actives, or low-viscosity fluids (e.g., hyaluronic acid serums, vitamins, or peptides). However, hyperdilute Radiesse remains a semi-viscous suspension of microspheres. The electrical pulses may not effectively “transport” these particles through the stratum corneum without risking uneven distribution, aggregation, or skin irritation. Studies on electroporation focus on small molecules or soluble macromolecules, not particulate fillers like CaHA.
Safety and Efficacy Concerns: Injecting Radiesse ensures precise placement (e.g., supraperiosteal or subdermal for volumization; subcutaneous for biostimulation). Transdermal electroporation could lead to superficial deposition only, reducing biostimulatory effects and potentially causing transient pore disruption without lasting benefit. No adverse event data exists for this pairing, but electroporation’s reversible barrier disruption (restoring in hours) may not suffice for CaHA’s gradual neocollagenesis (peaking at 3–7 months).
Regulatory and Clinical Standards: All peer-reviewed guidelines (e.g., global consensus from Dermatologic Surgery, 2018; Plastic and Reconstructive Surgery Global Open, 2019) emphasize needle/cannula injection for diluted/hyperdiluted CaHA, with dilution ratios tailored to cannulas of specific gauges (e.g., 25–27G for 1:2 ratios). Electroporation is not mentioned in Radiesse’s instructions for use or biostimulation protocols.

Aspect	Standard Hyperdilute Radiesse Delivery (Injection)	Dermo-Electroporation (Theoretical for Fillers)
Primary Method	Needle or cannula (e.g., 22–27G)	Electrical pulses creating micro-channels
Depth Achieved	Subcutaneous/dermal (up to 5–10 mm)	Dermal/hypodermal (up to 5 mm)
Suitable Substances	Viscous CaHA suspensions (diluted 1:1 to 1:6)	Ionic solutions, low-viscosity serums
Efficacy Evidence	High (e.g., 70–90% improvement in laxity after 2–3 sessions)	None for CaHA; effective for HA/peptides
Risks	Bruising, swelling (resolves 1–3 days); rare nodules	Skin tingling, temporary redness; potential uneven particle spread
Duration of Results	12–24 months	N/A for this combo

Recommendations

Stick to Proven Methods: For hyperdilute Radiesse, opt for professional injection by a qualified dermatologist or aesthetic provider. Typical protocols involve 2–3 sessions spaced 4–8 weeks apart, with results visible in 1–3 months and lasting up to 2 years.
Alternatives via Electroporation: If seeking needle-free biostimulation, dermo-electroporation pairs well with hyperdiluted hyaluronic acid (HA) or collagen-boosting serums for similar (but milder) skin tightening effects.
Consult a Professional: Individual factors like skin type, age, and treatment area influence outcomes. Always discuss with a board-certified provider to avoid off-label risks.

If new research emerges (post-2025), this could change, but current data supports injection as the gold standard for hyperdilute Radiesse.

RapAdmin · October 23, 2025, 2:45am

And here is what CGPT5 says about:

Prompt: Could DEP devices deliver hyperdilute Radiesse via the process of dielectrophoresis?

Response:

In short: no — a DEP (dermo-electroporation) device cannot deliver hyper-dilute Radiesse by dielectrophoresis.

Here’s why, step by step:

DEP in Mattioli-style devices ≠ Dielectrophoresis

The “DEP” in Dermo Electro Poration is a marketing abbreviation for electroporation-like transdermal delivery — short, pulsed electric fields that temporarily open aqueous channels in the stratum corneum so ionic solutions can pass.
It is not the same physical mechanism as dielectrophoresis used in microfluidic or cell-sorting instruments.

What dielectrophoresis actually requires

True dielectrophoresis moves neutral, polarizable particles in a non-uniform electric field by creating induced dipoles.
Effective dielectrophoretic transport demands:

Particle size: typically ≤ 10 µm
Field gradients: 10⁴–10⁶ V/m over micrometer electrode gaps
Medium: low-conductivity fluid (10⁻³–10⁻⁵ S/m)
Path length: micrometers to a few millimeters

Clinical DEP devices for skincare operate at:

Field strengths ≈ 10²–10³ V/m
Millimeter-scale electrode spacing
Highly conductive tissue (0.1–1 S/m)

Those conditions collapse dielectrophoretic forces by several orders of magnitude.

Properties of hyper-dilute Radiesse

Particles: 25–45 µm calcium-hydroxylapatite microspheres (solid, heavy).
Carrier: viscous carboxymethyl-cellulose (CMC) gel, often mixed with saline.
Electrical behavior: high conductivity medium; non-polarizable solid spheres much larger than skin pores (~1–100 nm).

Under electric pulses from a dermo-electroporation handset, these particles cannot polarize or migrate through tissue barriers. They’d merely sit in the gel—no propulsion, no permeation.

Skin structure and safety limits

Generating the field gradients needed to physically move 25–45 µm particles through the epidermis would require voltages high enough to cause pain, burns, or arcing. Skin also presents highly non-uniform conductivity, destroying any controlled gradient necessary for dielectrophoresis.

Conclusion

DEP devices (dermo-electroporation) do not use dielectrophoresis, and even if they did, the physics make it impossible to drive CaHA microspheres through skin.

Hyper-dilute Radiesse remains an injectable suspension only; its delivery relies on mechanical placement into the dermis/subdermis, not electrical migration.

If the goal is needle-free collagen stimulation, you’d need ionic, water-based actives (e.g., polynucleotides, peptides, copper ions, calcium gluconate) that can actually respond to electroporation currents—not particulate implants like CaHA.

RapAdmin · October 23, 2025, 2:48am

Just checking on this again:

Prompt: What level of the dermis does Hyperdilute Radiesse need to get to, to act as a biostimulator?

CGPT5 Response:

Excellent, very precise question — and one that goes right to the heart of how CaHA (Radiesse) works as a biostimulatory filler rather than just a space-occupying implant.

Let’s go step-by-step through what the data and manufacturer guidance say.

Mechanism: why dermal depth matters

Radiesse (Calcium Hydroxylapatite microspheres in CMC gel) stimulates collagen primarily through:

Fibroblast activation caused by controlled mechanical stretch and macrophage-mediated response around the microspheres.
Neocollagenesis and neoelastogenesis occur over weeks to months as the gel carrier resorbs, leaving behind a lattice of CaHA that triggers fibroblast and vascular remodeling.

This process requires direct interaction with fibroblasts in the deep dermis and superficial subdermis — not just the upper papillary layer.

Depth targets in published protocols

Treatment goal	Injection plane	Typical needle depth	Reason
Facial volumization (undiluted)	Deep dermis → supraperiosteal	2–5 mm	Provides structure and lift
Hyper-dilute biostimulation (1:2 – 1:6 dilution)	Mid- to deep reticular dermis, or immediate subdermis	~1–3 mm depending on site	Optimizes fibroblast activation without visible nodules
Neck, décolleté, body skin quality	Deep dermis / upper subcutis	1.5–2.5 mm	Stimulates collagen & elastin uniformly across thinner skin

References:

Goldie et al., J Drugs Dermatol, 2018 (“Global Consensus on CaHA Hyperdilution”)
Moradi et al., Dermatol Surg, 2020 (“Hyperdilute CaHA for skin laxity”)
Merz Aesthetics Radiesse Injection Guide (professional monograph)

All agree: the particles must contact fibroblast-rich reticular dermis, generally 1–3 mm below the surface, to trigger the collagen-inducing response.

Why shallower or deeper placement is less effective

Too superficial (papillary dermis, < 0.5 mm)	Optimal (mid-reticular dermis ≈ 1–3 mm)	Too deep (subcutaneous > 4–5 mm)
Visible whitening, nodules, uneven texture	Contact with fibroblasts → collagen & elastin synthesis	Less fibroblast density → weak stimulation, delayed effect

So, the sweet spot is the mid-reticular dermis — roughly 1–2 mm depth on face, or 2–3 mm on neck/body — deep enough for fibroblast contact, shallow enough to stay within dermal collagen network.

Delivery summary

Product: Radiesse or Radiesse(+lidocaine), diluted 1:2 – 1:6 with saline ± lidocaine
Injection plane: mid-to-deep reticular dermis / upper subdermis
Needle or cannula depth: typically 1–3 mm facial, 2–3 mm neck/body
Spread technique: linear-thread, fanning, or micro-bolus (~0.1 mL each point)
Goal: even dermal distribution of microspheres in fibroblast zone, avoiding papillary dermis and visible blanching

Bottom line

For Radiesse (even when hyper-diluted) to act as a biostimulator, it must reach at least the mid- to deep reticular dermis—approximately 1–3 mm below the skin surface, where fibroblasts, collagen, and elastin fibers are densest.

That’s the depth that cannot be achieved by electroporation or topical means — it requires mechanical injection to place CaHA microspheres within that fibroblast-rich zone.

RapAdmin · October 23, 2025, 2:57am

And… @medaura , then the question becomes:

If a person was to try using dermoelectroporation for delivery of hyper-dilute Radiesse, and the solution does seem to be absorbed into the skin, what do you think is happening with the Radiesse solution?

CGPT5 Response:

That’s an insightful question — and it gets into what’s physically plausible when someone reports that hyper-dilute Radiesse “seems” to absorb after applying a dermo-electroporation (DEP) treatment.

Let’s parse what’s likely happening under physics, chemistry, and physiology — rather than what might appear visually.

What “absorption” looks like — and what it really is

When a clinician or patient observes that a hyper-dilute Radiesse mixture “disappears” from the surface during a DEP session, several non-delivery processes can mimic true absorption:

Apparent effect	Actual mechanism
Serum or gel visually vanishes	The aqueous carrier (saline/lidocaine/water) evaporates or is wicked into the stratum corneum, leaving microspheres behind.
Smooth surface after wiping	The CaHA microspheres settle into fine surface irregularities or remain on the stratum corneum as a thin residue that is later wiped or rinsed off.
Mild plumping or glow afterward	Caused by temporary hydration, mild edema, and increased superficial circulation from the electrical pulses — not from CaHA deposition in the dermis.
Short-term firmness feeling	Transient tissue impedance changes and epidermal tightening (electrical/thermal effects), not neocollagenesis.

So the “absorption” you see is optical and superficial, not migration of the microspheres through skin barriers.

What happens to the components of hyper-dilute Radiesse

A hyper-dilute mix is roughly:

CaHA microspheres (solid, 25–45 µm)
Carboxymethylcellulose (CMC) gel carrier
Diluent (saline ± lidocaine)

Under electroporation conditions:

a) The saline fraction

→ Conductive, ionic, and water-based — this part can temporarily move into the upper epidermis or evaporate.

b) The CMC gel

→ A non-ionic, viscous polymer. The electrical pulses don’t break it down; it mostly stays on the surface or forms a thin film.

c) The CaHA microspheres

→ Too large for any electroporation channel (pore size: ~1–100 nm vs. 25,000–45,000 nm particles).
They remain on the skin surface and are eventually wiped off. None penetrate to the reticular dermis.

What cannot be happening

The microspheres cannot pass through electroporated aqueous pores.
Dielectrophoretic forces in a skincare device are far too weak to move them through tissue.
There is no plausible path for them to reach fibroblasts in the mid-dermis (1–3 mm deep).

If you tested the treated skin histologically, you would not find CaHA microspheres in the dermis; you’d find normal epidermis with transient hydration changes.

What is happening beneficially

While the CaHA itself isn’t entering, the DEP session:

Delivers a mild ionic current, increasing local perfusion and temporary hydration.
Causes mild skin tightening from transient edema and keratinocyte activation.
May improve product penetration for the ionic diluent fraction (saline, lidocaine) — producing a cooling, plumping sensation.

Those superficial changes can look like “absorption” but are transient (hours–days).

Summary

If hyper-dilute Radiesse “seems to absorb” during a DEP session, the water and saline fraction are entering or evaporating, the gel and CaHA microspheres stay on or near the surface, and the perceived improvement is hydration and micro-edema, not true CaHA biostimulation.

For actual collagen induction, CaHA microspheres must be injected mechanically into the mid-to-deep dermis where fibroblasts reside.

RapAdmin · October 23, 2025, 3:17am

I’m going to initially try using the ionic preparations that were previously mentioned; testing out some samples from each of the major classifications:

Ranked by clinical signal (highest → lowest)

Polynucleotides (PN, incl. PDRN)
Copper peptide (GHK-Cu) & advanced peptide complexes
Topical Hyaluronic Acid (sodium hyaluronate) serums
DMAE (ionic solutions with DMAE)
Ionic calcium/mineral solutions (e.g., calcium gluconate/chloride)

By the way - this company was identified by CGPT5 as having some of the best prices on some of these:

RapAdmin · October 23, 2025, 5:24am

Here is what arrives in the box when you order this device. The main unit seems to be about 14 inches by about 10 inches.

This last photo is the cover of a rather strange sort of “manual” that is all in Chinese and looks to be more of a piece of marketing literature. I can’t see any instructions on how to use the device here, but when I get a chance I may photograph each page and run the images through ChatGPT and have it translated into English. Will post the results when I get them.

RapAdmin · October 23, 2025, 5:28am

I’ve searched around online to see if I can find an English manual for the device, but no luck. Instead I found these documents, that provide a little bit more information. I don’t know about the electronics inside, but the outside seems to be an almost exact knockoff of the real product. They even keep the Italian company’s “Mattioli Engineering” logo on the product.

MattioliOnDrugDelivery-sm.pdf (903.6 KB)

and here is the translation from the Italian Datasheet on the product (which you can download here if you want to).

Here’s the English translation and extracted text from your attached Italian data sheet (“DS_DEP_ITA.pdf”) for the Mattioli Engineering D.E.P. System:

D.E.P. System – Data Sheet

Overview

The D.E.P. System is a new stand-alone system for transdermal drug delivery, using Mattioli Engineering’s patented DermoElectroPoration® (DEP) technology.

It provides effective transdermal delivery under all conditions but is recommended after a microdermabrasion session. The Ultrapeel® systems can now be used synergistically with this stand-alone D.E.P. System.

The D.E.P. System is designed to ensure faster transdermal delivery, thanks to its new transdermal syringe, which integrates the probe with a digital dispenser, enabling the delivery of very small quantities of active compounds (such as Botulinum Toxin Type A) without product loss.

Components

The system consists of:

A Delivery Display, which regulates pulse intensity, vibration, and monitors skin impedance via an impedancemeter.
A Transderm® Syringe, integrating the probe and digital dispenser, ensuring constant and fast delivery.

The dispenser has a variable interface, allowing the treatment to be adjusted even during application to match the patient’s skin characteristics.

Technology

DermoElectroPoration® is Mattioli Engineering’s globally patented technology for transdermal delivery of drugs.

It exploits the naturally occurring aqueous channels in the skin to allow active substances to penetrate using electrical impulses with a waveform similar to electroporation, but with lower intensity and controlled duration.
These impulses temporarily increase skin permeability, allowing transdermal passage of both micro- and macromolecules without altering pH or causing electrolysis.

Unlike traditional iontophoresis:

It does not cause electrolysis or pH changes,
No return electrode or conductive gel is needed,
Delivery times are shorter, and
The substances are not altered during the process.

Applications

Dermatological treatments
Facial rejuvenation
Treatment of PEFS (cellulite) and localized adiposity
Skin firming
Treatment of hyperhidrosis
Mesotherapy treatments
Rheumatic and post-traumatic pathologies
Mesobotox treatments

Advantages

Capable of delivering even macromolecules (up to 2 million Daltons)
No electrolysis or pH changes in delivered substances
Monitors transdermal passage and skin impedance
Does not require conductive gel or return electrode

Technical Specifications

Parameter	Specification
Power Supply	100–240 V, 1A max
Average Pulse Current	±1, 2, 3, 4, 5 mA (preset, ±20%)
Load Range	0–15 kΩ
Pulse Frequency	2200 Hz
Pulse Duration	228 µs per phase
Burst Duration	22 ms
Skin Impedance Indicator	1–10 kΩ (±1 kΩ)
Dimensions	~34 × 24 × 10 cm
Weight	~1.9 kg

Additional Notes

FDA-approved as a substitute for injections
Demonstrated delivery capability for Botulinum Toxin Type A (shown in rat skin biopsy images in the original sheet)
Manufacturer:
Mattioli Engineering Italia S.p.A.
Via Petrarca 80-82, 50041 Calenzano (Firenze), Italy
Tel: +39 055 882247 | Fax: +39 055 8874879
info@mattioliengineering.com
Website: www.mattioliengineering.com

For the Engineers here:

These are the FDA 510K filing documents on the original Italian product:

Summary of Safety and Effectiveness FDA Filing Document - 2003

Summary of Safety and Effectiveness FDA Filing Document - 2004

RapAdmin · October 23, 2025, 5:30am

Another related document:

DermTimes Botox without the needle pdf.pdf (516.6 KB)

RapAdmin · October 23, 2025, 5:42am

The clinical evidence for the use of this device in botox seems pretty minimal:

CGPT5 Summary

Short answer: there’s very little human clinical evidence that DermoElectroPoration (DEP) or classic iontophoresis can deliver botulinum toxin A (BoNT-A) through intact skin for cosmetic benefits like wrinkles, pores, or oil control. What exists is (a) animal/ex vivo proof-of-concept and (b) small human hyperhidrosis studies—not facial rejuvenation—plus separate lines of evidence where other modalities (fractional lasers, microneedling/RF, microjet injectors) help topical BoNT-A penetrate. Here’s the evidence landscape:

What’s actually been shown

1) Iontophoresis—animal model (proof of delivery, not outcomes)

A JAAD letter showed pulsed-current iontophoresis moved BoNT-A across living rat skin (fluorescently tracked), establishing feasibility but not cosmetic outcomes. (J Am Acad Dermatol)

2) Iontophoresis—human palmar hyperhidrosis (not aesthetics)

A small randomized, double-blind, placebo-controlled trial suggested BTX-A could be delivered to palms by iontophoresis, reducing sweating (sample size was very small). This targets eccrine glands, not facial skin quality. (J Am Acad Dermatol)
Later reviews echo that pilot/early studies reported benefit for palmar hyperhidrosis, but data are sparse and not widely replicated. (PMC)

3) DEP (DermoElectroPoration) specifically

I couldn’t find peer-reviewed human trials showing DEP delivering BoNT-A for skin rejuvenation. Manufacturer materials describe the concept and show rat-skin biopsy imagery, but they’re not clinical trials. (mattioliengineering.eu)

4) Other needle-sparing/assisted approaches (not iontophoresis/DEP)
These don’t validate iontophoresis/DEP, but they show how clinicians have achieved nontraditional or assisted BoNT-A delivery:

Fractional CO₂ laser–assisted drug delivery (LADD): RCTs and controlled studies report improvement with topical BoNT-A in hyperhidrosis and in scar/keloid management when combined with fractional lasers. (PubMed)
Jet/microjet or laser-powered needle-free injectors: early clinical data (safety/feasibility) for delivering BoNT-A without needles—again, not iontophoresis/DEP. (PMC)
Microneedling-assisted BoNT-A and intradermal “microbotox” show benefits for pores/oil/texture, but these are injections or microchannel-assisted, not transdermal by current alone. (PMC)

Bottom line for your question

For DEP/iontophoresis delivering “botox” for skin benefits (wrinkles, pores, oil): no robust human clinical evidence. The strongest iontophoresis data are preclinical (rat) and small human trials in palms for hyperhidrosis, which doesn’t translate to facial aesthetic outcomes. (J Am Acad Dermatol)
If you’re evaluating needle-free routes for cosmetic use, the best-supported clinical pathways so far are not iontophoresis/DEP but laser-assisted delivery, microneedling-assisted delivery, or microjet injectors, each with early but growing evidence—still not equivalent to standard intradermal injection evidence. (PubMed)

RapAdmin · October 23, 2025, 6:17am

Since I could not find a real user manual for the device, I asked ChatGPT about user operating instructions for the device, and here is what it came back with:

Here’s a concise, step-by-step operating checklist for the Mattioli Engineering D.E.P. (DermoElectroPoration®) System, distilled from the device’s spec sheet and vendor materials. It’s written for trained operators and doesn’t replace the official IFU / user manual. Where details vary by model/handpiece or local regulation, default to the manufacturer’s instructions.

Quick-start operating checklist (point-by-point)

0) Clinical & safety gate

Screen the patient for common contraindications to electrical/energy devices and transdermal delivery (e.g., implanted electronic devices, pregnancy, seizure history, active skin infection, open wounds, metal implants in field, known allergy to the substance, photosensitizers on skin).
Obtain consent and document indication, substance, lot/expiry, intended area, and expected outcomes.
Use only appropriate topical/ionic solutions intended for transdermal administration; do not improvise with non-sterile or unapproved compounds.
PPE & asepsis: hand hygiene, gloves; use sterile/disposable components per the model’s instructions.

Note: D.E.P. uses pulsed current to transiently increase skin permeability via aqueous channels; it does notrequire a return electrode or conductive gel. Monitor skin impedance continuously and keep within the acceptable range. (polarismedicallasers.co.uk)

1) Room & device setup

Power: Connect the base unit to mains (100–240 V). Power on and let the system self-check.
Handpiece / probe: Attach the D.E.P. handpiece (and, if your unit has it, the Transderm® syringe/digital dispenser that integrates the probe). Ensure connectors lock firmly and the cable is undamaged.
Impedance display: Confirm the impedance indicator is visible on the delivery display (you’ll use it to tune contact/parameters). The device typically reads ~1–10 kΩ. (polarismedicallasers.co.uk)

2) Medication / solution prep

Load the disposable syringe with the prescribed solution (observe sterility and expiry).
Purge air from the syringe/tubing; prime until a uniform meniscus appears at the tip.
Mount syringe into the digital dispenser (if equipped). Set drop/flow to minimal to start; you can increase during treatment to match tissue uptake and target volume.
Label the syringe (drug, lot, expiry) in your chart.

3) Skin preparation

Cleanse & degrease the treatment area (makeup off; alcohol or chlorhexidine per clinic protocol).
(Optional but recommended): perform light microdermabrasion to thin the stratum corneum and improve uniformity, then re-cleanse. The manufacturer promotes synergy with their Ultrapeel® systems. (Mattioli Engineering)
Dry the skin thoroughly; moisture variability affects impedance.

4) Parameter selection (initial)

Mode: Select standard D.E.P. delivery mode.
Pulse current (Avg mA): Start low (e.g., ±1–2 mA) and titrate to ±3–5 mA only if needed/tolerated, staying within the device’s preset steps (±1, 2, 3, 4, 5 mA).
Frequency & pulse structure: The platform uses ~2200 Hz pulses, ~228 µs/phase in ~22 ms bursts (preconfigured). You don’t generally change these; verify your model’s defaults. (polarismedicallasers.co.uk)
Impedance target: Aim for a stable reading in the device’s acceptable window (≈1–10 kΩ). If high, improve contact/pressure, re-dry skin, or lightly re-prep.

5) Application technique

Grid the field: Mentally divide the area into small zones (e.g., 2–3 cm squares) for even coverage.
Contact: Place the probe flat; ensure consistent, gentle pressure.
Start delivery: Activate pulses. Begin with minimal drip/dispense, letting capillary action and pulses aid uptake.
Glide method: Move in slow, overlapping passes (linear or cross-hatch). Watch for uniform sheen (no beading/runoff).
Tune on the fly using the interface:

If impedance rises or tingling increases → reduce current slightly, improve contact, re-dry skin.
If no uptake → slightly increase flow rate or dwell time per zone rather than over-wetting.

Zone timing: Typical dwell per small zone is ~30–90 s; adjust by tissue response and total target volume.
Total session time / volume: Varies by indication and product. Vendor materials describe high throughput delivery (e.g., up to ~15 cc in ~30 min); plan conservatively and never force volume into poorly absorbing skin. (The Aesthetic Guide)

6) Monitoring & troubleshooting

Patient feedback: Expect mild tingling/vibration; no sharp pain or burning. If present, stop, reassess settings/skin prep.
Impedance excursions: If outside the acceptable band, pause, blot skin dry, reduce current, and re-establish contact.
Pooling/runoff: Lower flow; increase dwell and contact.
Hot spots/erythema: Skip ahead, lower current, and return after recovery; avoid over-treating one spot.

7) Session wrap-up

Deactivate pulses and stop flow.
Remove residues: Gently wipe excess solution; apply bland emollient if indicated.
Post-care: Standard photoprotection; avoid irritants (retinoids/acids) on the area for 24 h unless otherwise directed.
Dispose of the used syringe and any single-use tips per biohazard protocol.
Disinfect probe exteriors/handpiece per manufacturer’s material compatibility list (no soaking of electrical parts).
Document: settings (mA range, time), solution type/lot/volume, skin response, and any adverse events.

8) Maintenance & QC (routine)

Daily: Visual inspection of cables, connectors, housing; clean external surfaces.
Weekly: Check handpiece contacts, verify impedance readout on a test pad (if provided).
Firmware/Service: Follow scheduled service/calibration from the distributor or manufacturer.

Handy reference (from device specs)

Power: 100–240 V
Avg pulse current presets: ±1 / 2 / 3 / 4 / 5 mA (±20%)
Load (patient): 0–15 kΩ
Pulse frequency: ~2200 Hz • Pulse duration: ~228 µs/phase • Burst: ~22 ms
Skin impedance indicator: ≈1–10 kΩ display range
Approx. size/weight: ~34×24×10 cm; ~1.9 kg (polarismedicallasers.co.uk)

Important notes & limits

Follow the official operating manual for your exact model (Transderm®/Ultrapeel® variants differ slightly and the full IFU includes the authoritative contraindications, warnings, and test procedures). (Mattioli Engineering)
Claims you may see online (e.g., FDA clearance for local administration of ionic drug solutions, high delivery throughput) come from vendor communications and trade-press writeups; rely on your local regulatory guidance and the device’s cleared indications in your jurisdiction. (The Aesthetic Guide)

If you want, I can turn this into a one-page laminated SOP with blanks for dose/solution, target area, mA range, time, and post-care so your team can use it chairside.

RapAdmin · October 23, 2025, 4:56pm

I really didn’t know what “light microdermabrasion” meant, so did a little digging:

You mentioned this “perform light microdermabrasion to thin the stratum corneum”, can you elaborate on some simple, low cost strategies for doing this?

Response:

Here are simple, low-cost options for light stratum-corneum thinning before DermoElectroPoration or other transdermal delivery.
These are all gentle mechanical or chemical micro-exfoliation approaches—enough to reduce skin impedance and improve uniformity, but not to cause inflammation.

1. Gentle mechanical microdermabrasion

Method	Description	Cost / Tools	Tips
Diamond-tip wand	Home/clinic devices with a fine diamond-coated tip and mild suction	~$100–300 for portable systems; ~$10–20 per tip	Use fine grit (100–150 µm). One to two light passes; keep skin taut. Avoid erythema or pinpoint bleeding.
Crystal microdermabrasion	Aluminum-oxide or sodium-bicarbonate crystals sprayed under vacuum	~$1–2 per session consumables (if you already own a unit)	Slightly deeper than diamond; clean thoroughly afterward to avoid residual crystals before DEP.
Manual microdermabrasion pad	Textured silicone or micro-alumina pads	<$20	Circular motion for ~30 s per area with mild pressure; rinse well.

2. Enzymatic exfoliation (non-abrasive)

Enzyme type	Example products / actives	Notes
Papain (papaya enzyme)	DIY gel with 0.5–1 % papain or commercial “enzyme peel”	Works by digesting corneocyte junctions; no mechanical trauma.
Bromelain (pineapple enzyme)	0.5–1 % solution or sheet mask	Apply 5–10 min; rinse before DEP.

These leave the stratum corneum slightly loosened without disrupting deeper barrier lipids.

3. Mild chemical micro-peel

Acid	Typical safe range for pre-DEP	Notes
Lactic acid 5–10 %	Apply 1–3 min, neutralize, rinse, pat dry	Hydrophilic, increases skin hydration and electrical conductivity.
Glycolic acid 5–8 %	1–2 min contact	Avoid higher strengths (>10 %) before electrical procedures.
PHA (gluconolactone) 5–10 %	For sensitive skin	Gentle; minimal irritation; also humectant.

Always ensure no active erythema or tingling remains before applying electrical energy—wait 5–10 minutes and blot dry.

4. Physical pre-treatment substitutes (if no dermabrasion device)

Medical-grade microfiber cloth moistened with warm water, circular motion for ~1 minute.
Gentle clay mask (kaolin) left for 5–10 min, then rinsed: mildly absorbs oils and loosens corneocytes.
1 % baking-soda paste lightly rubbed for 30 s then rinsed: inexpensive but use rarely to avoid alkalinization.

5. Verification step

Wipe the area with alcohol or saline and allow full drying.
If you have an impedance readout (like the DEP base unit), ideal baseline is usually <10 kΩ—if it’s >15 kΩ, re-prep lightly.

Practical low-cost routine

Cleanse with mild foaming cleanser.
Diamond-tip microdermabrasion wand, one light pass.
Optional: enzyme gel 5 min, rinse, pat dry.
Wait 5 min until skin is completely dry.
Proceed with DermoElectroPoration.

This combination gives ~10–20 % reduction in barrier resistance without irritation or downtime—sufficient for enhanced transdermal uptake.

medaura · October 23, 2025, 5:39pm

Ok a lot of thoughts and comments I’ll try to wrap up in one.

seeing how a light microdermabrasion session was highly encouraged to reduce skin impedance and physically remove the outermost layer, I got this from Temu and works pretty well — it seems to reduce the duration of a DEP session, meaning lets product get absorbed faster, with less left at the very end that you can’t “push through.” Posting picture instead of link as the product links expire often but you can search by image so hopefully this is evergreen

the product manual that comes in Chinese is completely useless and should be called a marketing brochure instead. Not worth translating in English if all you want are clear instructions on how to use the machine. For that I’d suggest webinars on Youtube but even those are overkill. It’s really stupid simple: 1) clean your face well 2) ideally exfoliate via microdermabrasion so you have fewer dead skin cells at the surface 2) dry skin 3) apply the solution to the skin via syringe or other applicator 4) rub it in with the DEP probe while the device is turned on 5) keep the setting to 1-3 on the face, 3-5 on the body 6) the higher the current, the faster the absorption but the feeling is too uncomfortable on the face on higher settings, I can only do up to 2 around the eye / lip area and I have a high tolerance for discomfort 7) there’s a vibration setting, low / high / none but that does nothing other than help mask the sensation of the current so choose whichever helps you not mind the most. That’s it. Just rub around until the solution is mostly gone. You’ll understand the impedance reading as a gauge of how much each spot on the skin can keep absorbing.
Last and most certainly not least, @RapAdmin I think ChatGPT is full of shit on this, and who knows what else. I had started wondering this past two weeks as I’ve been knee deep in research on orthodontic treatments — a very alien landscape to me hitherto — for my daughters. What I have learned without a doubt and before even consulting ChatGPT is that I have been very wrong in the past to overlook or postpone orthodontic treatments as something having to do merely with reorganizing teeth around and that can be done at any time until adolescence or even adulthood (with an implied “no rush” stance). The jaw is only growing for so long in childhood, or at least growing fast enough to make a difference in its trajectory via the right intervention. But my growing suspicion has been that ChatGPT has a strong built in bias, at least when it comes to anything remotely pertaining medical questions, towards the most orthodox and conservative options out there. I can see why that’s desirable for its makers from a cover-your-ass-perspective but it does warp the direction of exploratory conversations. And I’m actually struggling with myself as I weigh two very different approaches for my kids, with different implications for their long term health, about whether I’m being unduly swayed by ChatGPT towards the “safest” options. I tend to trust it more implicitly because it has no emotional biases or needs to impress but as I compare even different models of generative LLMs I see they each bring their different baggage to the table. I’m still torn on my upcoming decisions re: orthodontics but about this, for skin, I can tell from personal experience it’s wrong.

It said I must have been experiencing the hydroxyapatite microspheres being left behind on my skin and not going beneath it while the carrier gel only gets absorbed and that’s simply not true. So yes there is a bit of a hint of a leftover film that’s not absorbed (consistency of chalk dust almost, when it’s dry) that’s maybe 5-10% of the volume and mass of it that came in the syringe. I see how much I had in the beginning and how much is left later and I’d have to be brain damaged to mistake the amount by orders of magnitude. What’s most interesting is last time I left that layer dry out completely and then about an hour later I went and “injected” a skin booster on top of it, and that pushed through the last remnant of that chalk dust. None left at the very end. It’s as if it needed to be washed down with something else.

Also I caught an actual error in its reasoning: hyperdilute Radiesse needs to be injected very superficially, hence mesotherapy as its technique. It’s undiluted radiesse that needs to be injected deep. So for the former 0.4-1.2 mm is what you’re typically looking at for depth, depending on the area (neck skin being thinnest, eye area second thinnest, etc.) so even its input premise was wrong. I think the reason for it is because hyper dilute radiesse is itself rather new and off the beaten path whereas most of its training leans towards established textbook examples.

Also my skin doesn’t look better right after I finish a session. Typically it’s a bit red and irritated in fact. It’s 2-3 weeks after that I find myself beginning to stop in front of the mirror and go wow. About 4 weeks later it’s unmistakable.

The way it stubbornly denied Botox being able to be delivered via DEP would have sounded insufferably conceited if it were coming from a human mind. This mode of delivery is established in clinical practice. It simply gets done! People who are terrified of needles use DEP and they wouldn’t keep going for the treatment if it didn’t work. There’s no placebo effect to Botox. I have never used it myself but know many many people who have and they are clear that you feel it right away as to whether it makes it harder to move your muscles. For hyperhydrosis you know if you’re sweating bullets or not. Besides Mattioli has its own histological studies showing Botox penetration. Just because ChatGPT doesn’t see a slew of double blind placebo controlled studies on a case that frankly will never justify their commissioning, categorically denying the validity of the company published case studies is wrong headed and close minded.

In my case I’m seeing and experiencing great results that speak for themselves when I look in the mirror. Was stopped by ex pats I met while on vacation in the summer who after a few minutes of chit chat would ask me, ok but tell me, what do you do to your skin — I can’t believe you’re almost 40 with 5 kids, tell me your secrets! I had good skin before but no one would say such things until this year. Radiesse for me, even a Chinese knock off, even hyperdiluted, is creating a subtle bulk of new tissue that gives the look of a younger face, visually rewinding the clock to maybe 8 years ago, judging from my old photos. My energy devices are great but they seem to work by taking away volume to tighten, making everything a little thinner. It’s tightening via subtraction. They’re the chisel in the arsenal. Radiesse via DEP has been like adding clay to a clay sculpture. Just another layer of depth / volume wherever I need it the most. Combine the two and I am finally at rest, meaning I feel no more fomo to buy more devices or try something else off Alibaba. I am at peace with what I own.

If you’d like, I am happy to ship you off a vial of my Radiesse (probably fake) and of my NCFT 135ha. I’ll shoot you a video of exactly how to mix them with a luer lock and use them. You can tell me if 80% or more of the solution got absorbed or not, and whether you look any different 3-4 weeks later. To me the importance of randomized controlled trials lies in providing an unbiased best guess as to whether something will work for me or mine. In this case I already know it works because I’ve tried it so they’re an afterthought. If you don’t trust my knockoff Radiesse, I highly recommend getting yourself a real vial. You can get them from Europe for around $200 or even less. And see for yourself if it works. It would be a shame to have the device and be prevented from using it to the fullest by a LLM opinion. Worst case you’ll be $200 down.

Sue · October 23, 2025, 8:06pm

I bought PlinestFast from Twoface aesthetics.

RapAdmin · October 23, 2025, 8:13pm

So this product:

$202.50 USD

Let us know how it goes!

medaura · October 23, 2025, 11:11pm

IndiaMart has some nice stuff in this department too. Look up polynucleotides. The best known brand is Rejuran but it’s rather expensive and the use cases I saw were primarily for surface level irregularities and I don’t need improvement there. If it were cheaper I’d be tempted.

Sue · October 24, 2025, 1:30am

Yes I paid top price. It won’t happen again. I want the good European stuff. This appears to be a cellular longevity product. It’s not injected in the US. I am excited about it.
" PN is regenerative medicine, not just cosmetic filling. It’s closer to tissue engineering—improving fibroblast viability, increasing ATP turnover, stabilizing extracellular matrix enzymes, and improving wound healing."

RapAdmin · October 24, 2025, 6:17am

I have to say, when I read this my eyes rolled around and the though of “not another device” came to mind…

I have a Dremel, and good cordless drills. There has to be some sort of “microdermabrasion” options for these device for the males in the audience…

Alas, ChatGPT did not come through:

Short answer: I was unable to find any consumer-oriented handheld microdermabrasion device that is explicitly marketed for body skin exfoliation using a standard rotary tool (such as a Dremel handset) or a “Dremel-style” spinning accessory designed for skin. Most at-home microdermabrasion devices are dedicated beauty/skin-care tools rather than repurposed rotary tools.

I mean I’m all in on new tech, but another sanding tool (ah, but this time optimized for skin…) seems like overkill. So - I’m not bought into it as of now.

I’m only half-kidding when I say that I think there is a huge unmet need out there for microdermabrasion drill bits and Dremel attachments for men getting into skin care

Thanks for the DEP Use instructions - good to get a quick summary!

On the issue of DEP with Radiesse - sure, chatGPT is frequently wrong. But I did query all the other AIs - Gemini, Claude, and Grok - and they all said basically the same thing. At the same time, I do agree with you that these systems are giving huge weights to the RCT studies that are published in great papers, so they are going to lag in their information and summaries in areas where there isn’t that much research, so they could all be off on this topic.

It would be interesting to have side-by-side comparisons of your DEP approach with Radiesse, vs. it done by a traditional mesotherapy needle approach and see if there is much difference (or perhaps if someone has / will try both approaches), it would be an interesting comparison.

On the botox example - I checked on Grok and they came back very positive on the DEP approach to doing botox. So yes - this could be another case where the AI systems are biased towards a conservative interpretation of the data. Have you ever tried the DEP approach to botox? Grok suggested it’s more common in Asia and Europe. The idea of “do it yourself” needle-less botox would seem to appeal to a broad market if it actually works.

scta123 · October 24, 2025, 9:24am

Radiesse isn’t suitable for classic mesotherapy. Hyperdiluted Radiesse should only be placed with cannulas using a fan technique and it’s not a DIY procedure and requires proper training and solid anatomical knowledge because serious complications can occur (nodules or granulomas or severe risks from accidental injection into a blood vessel, which can lead to vision abnormalities, blindness, stroke, or permanent scarring).

I’ve looked into the DEP approach with Radiesse and I’m still on the fence. Logically it shouldn’t work, yet there are people like @medaura and the Canadian doctor she referenced reporting success. I’m getting a DEP device next week and plan to try it with the original Radiesse. Worst case I’m out 94 eur. Best case it works, and I’ll be happy instead of trying to explain why.

medaura · October 24, 2025, 12:38pm

Believe it or not that’s how I felt — not another device!—because for the first time I feel satiated with devices. That little thing is basically a toy though, both cheap and little and can fit in a drawer. From using tretinoin my skin is prone to peeling so it’s nice to have as insurance if I’m shedding hard and need to look presentable that day. But it’s not absolutely necessary by any means. If you can’t be bothered to buy and use one, the next best thing are those makeup removal wipes from Burt’s Bees or similar: you wipe your face with them and they pull away dead skin cells, as opposed to merely rinsing it off with face wash.

medaura · October 24, 2025, 12:54pm

You’re very correct about the nonnegotiable need for precise technique with hyperdilute radiesse. I learned a lot about it from a webinar that I actually can’t link to as it was downloaded from somewhere or other but yes, cannula or judicious combo of cannula and needle, fanning, linear retrograde technique etc. When I said mesotherapy I didn’t mean to imply any delivery technique would do, merely that it needs to be injected superficially. To me the DEP has been amazing in that it moots nearly all these technical requirements. Of course the traditional way allows for more precise application, focusing on problem areas better. But to me it’s more important to be able to apply it evenly all over my face and neck so losing some precision isn’t a big deal. I do wish I could use undiluted radiesse for strategic volume placement here and there but so far it hasn’t amounted to a need. In 5-10 years I’ll probably bite the bullet and pay to have it done. Meanwhile I should think Sculptra (PLLA) should work with DEP and offer something similar.