New drug combination shows massive fat loss and muscle gain without steroids - "The End Of Steroids?

[Davin8r]

@Thorin

mice on the GLP-1 got to eat what they wanted, whatever they ate was tracke

Do you have a reference/link to this study?

[AustraliaLongevity]

Yea I’d like to see it too.

[Thorin]

Please see this. It is a bit long. If you start by examining figure 3A you’ll be in the right part of the study if I recall correctly. It has been some time since I read it slowly and carefully, I just scanned it now. Please let me know your thoughts once you’ve had a chance to digest it. Thanks.
https://doi.org/10.1016/j.cmet.2022.07.013

[relaxedmeatball]

@Thorin

GLP-1’s have quickly become very popular with the bodybuilding community. You can visit some of the forums and verify for yourself. So these folks do want the “help”.

Well sure. But they also take whatever research chemicals off the Internet. That doesn’t mean much, haha. I was a pretty active member of those communities for a decade or more.

@Thorin

Mice broken up into 2 groups, one on a GLP-1, the other was not. The mice on the GLP-1 got to eat what they wanted, whatever they ate was tracked. The other group of mice got to eat the exact same amount as the GLP-1 mice had eaten. So the calories were identical.

I was going to ask you to share, then saw that you just did a few moments ago, thanks. I would gladly stand corrected because I wasn’t aware of any new evidence. I know the whole “GLP-1RA = muscle loss” thing is predicated mostly on obese people who don’t exercise, and I had presumed the effect could be negated by exercise. But of course the pharma companies work on the Activin A stuff because it would be a huge money-maker to be co-prescribed alongside every GLP1R1 prescription. The study you shared seems to be talking about a new drug, and not any of the drugs people are currently using, so I’m not sure how to interpret it.

[AustraliaLongevity]

@relaxedmeatball

The study you shared seems to be talking about a new drug, and not any of the drugs people are currently using, so I’m not sure how to interpret it.

LY3437943 is retatrutide. I’ve seen anecdotal reports that it is a bit more muscle sparing compared to tirzepatide and semaglutide.

Most muscle loss is just improper use.

@relaxedmeatball

But of course the pharma companies work on the Activin A stuff because it would be a huge money-maker to be co-prescribed alongside every GLP1R1 prescription.

I’m sure they’re looking at a lot more than just myostatin and activin A. I say bring it on!

We need something to help with motor units as well, they seem to heavily rely on extensive exercise to maintain. But heavy exercise isn’t good for longevity.

[Davin8r]

@AustraliaLongevity

LY3437943 is retatrutide

I actually misread @Thorin’s original post. Yes he’s right, the newer drugs (at least the ones that agonize receptors beyond just GLP-1) do definitely have effects beyond decreased caloric intake, especially those with glucagon activity (retatrutide, mazdutide, survodutide and others in development).

The glucagon agonism causes increased caloric expenditure, which is indeed independent of caloric intake and results in weight loss over and above what you’d see with GLP-1 and/or GIP agonism alone. Tirzepatide also causes a small increase in energy expenditure, although much less than the others with GCG agonism.

[Thorin]

I’ve been using Retatrutide for over a year now. It is not FDA approved yet so anyone using it is in a study or buying it from overseas peptide providers (which is what I’ve been doing). Many, many people are using it.

From what I have been able to find, I am not sure if Reta is more muscle sparing than Tirzepatide. I would like to know which is best on that measure but I have not come across anything convincing on it. Like you, I think Reta might be the best on that, but I am just not sure.

I am not saying the answer to that is not known by anyone, I am merely admitting it is not known by me. I would like to know.

[Davin8r]

We’ll get some retatrutide DEXA body comp data when the first of the phase 3 trial data is released later this year. Can’t wait!

[Thorin]

That is exciting! I did not know that. Thank you for sharing.

[Steve_Combi]

@relaxedmeatball

Bodybuilders are very used to counting calories, tracking macronutrients, and don’t need the “help”.

I don’t know any lifters who can bench over 400 that are not taking PEDS.

[ageless64]

I have not found any research that investigates muscle preservation on reta. There is some speculation among users on Reddit that glucagon receptor activation might help preserve muscle mass by increasing energy expenditure and promoting fat breakdown. While this may not directly impact muscle, perhaps since reta achieves some of its fat loss via increased metabolism, the caloric deficit required for the same amount of fat loss is lower; therefore, muscle mass loss due to calorie restriction is also lower. Anyhow, I think the key is to have reasonable nutrition and protein intake and keep resistance training. I have not tried any GLP1s yet, but I’ve lost a few pounds of fat a week with calorie restriction while simultaneously gaining some muscle by following this formula.

[Steve_Combi]

@Thorin

I am not sure if Reta is more muscle sparing than Tirzepatide.

This one is on 2.0mg Reta weekly.

Our son Adam, 41y/o, 185lb, benches 285 for 5 reps, max 420, dead lifts 600, has extreme grip strength and can close the heaviest COC gripper .
https://ironmind.com/product-info/ironmind-grippers/captains-of-crush-grippers/

[AustraliaLongevity]

@Steve_Combi

can close the heaviest COC gripper .

That’s a very difficult feat.

[Steve_Combi]

You don’t want him to grab you, that’s for sure! LoL!

His grandfather had crazy grip strength as well. Could pick up 1x 40kg bag of grain in each hand with his thumbs and forefingers and carry them a good distance. You did not want him to grab you by the ear! I’ve seen him walk up to cows, grab them by the nose and have complete control over them.