My DAV* Therapy begins! *Doxycycline, Azithromycin and Vitamin C

I really want to try it too, but it is the harvest now and I can’t afford to get sick. I look forward to hearing how it goes for you all.

I really really would rather use the Doxy Myr. I’d like to give it to my daughter as well who is using it for her cancer. She’s consulted a bunch of people that really don’t know the dosage either. We don’t want to use too much and cause unnecessary discomfort. Doxy Myr sounded like a no-brainer.

I would think the Chinese would be making it, or the Indians. I see why it’s not being done here. The profit would be small, and liability large.

2 Likes

I am a sucker for a new movement so I jumped in on this one too. I figured I had everything on hand and take doxy with my rapa dose anyway. So why not? Day 2 out of 37, nothing to report except some very mild GI disturbances that could be placebo or unrelated. Giddy up DAV!!! Wohoo. :facepunch:

2 Likes

No, I do not think so.

You are a person who thinks and follows;

“If you wait until you are ready, it is almost certainly too late.”
~Seth Godin

*You are not the waiting type

2 Likes

[quote=“Bicep, post:120, topic:9619”].

…“Doxy Myr sounded like a no-brainer.”…
[/quote]

Started a separate thread on “Doxycycline Myr.”

A Myristoyl Amide Derivative of Doxycycline

Taking two antibiotics based on a patent and not published clinical research is not a no brainer. Any possible negative effect on the microbiome aside, azitromycin is associated with an increased risk of sudden cardiovascular death.

During 5 days of therapy, patients taking azithromycin, as compared with those who took no antibiotics, had an increased risk of cardiovascular death (hazard ratio, 2.88; 95% confidence interval [CI], 1.79 to 4.63; P<0.001) and death from any cause (hazard ratio, 1.85; 95% CI, 1.25 to 2.75; P=0.002). Patients who took amoxicillin had no increase in the risk of death during this period. Relative to amoxicillin, azithromycin was associated with an increased risk of cardiovascular death (hazard ratio, 2.49; 95% CI, 1.38 to 4.50; P=0.002) and death from any cause (hazard ratio, 2.02; 95% CI, 1.24 to 3.30; P=0.005), with an estimated 47 additional cardiovascular deaths per 1 million courses; patients in the highest decile of risk for cardiovascular disease had an estimated 245 additional cardiovascular deaths per 1 million courses. The risk of cardiovascular death was significantly greater with azithromycin than with ciprofloxacin but did not differ significantly from that with levofloxacin.

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/nejmoa1003833

A stopped clinical trial with Azitromycin showed an increase risk of cancer relapse and death for people undergoing stem cell transplants:

Researchers in France identified this increased risk of cancer relapse and death while conducting a clinical trial investigating the effectiveness of long-term azithromycin to prevent bronchiolitis obliterans syndrome in patients who undergo donor, or allogenic, stem cell transplants for cancers of the blood and lymph nodes.

The researchers stopped the ALLOZITHRO1 trial approximately 13 months after the study completed enrollment of 480 patients because an unexpected increase in the rate of both cancer relapses and death was observed in patients taking azithromycin. Cancer relapse was observed in 77 patients (32.9%) with azithromycin treatment compared to 48 patients (20.8%) with placebo, which is an inactive treatment. A total of 95 patients died in the azithromycin treatment group versus 66 patients in the placebo group; thus, the 2-year survival rate was 56.6% in azithromycin-treated patients compared to 70.1% in those receiving a placebo. In the first few months of the trial, the death rate was about equal between those receiving azithromycin and placebo. However, an imbalance occurred subsequently and continued until the 2-year time point when the study was stopped.

https://www.fda.gov/drugs/drug-safety-and-availability/fda-warns-about-increased-risk-cancer-relapse-long-term-use-azithromycin-zithromax-zmax-antibiotic

7 Likes

FWIW

If you locate or have it manufacturer{the Myristoyl Amide Derivative of Doxycycline] I would start with 20mg dose. Which should be equivalent to 100mg of doxycycline according to the published paper.

Try contacting the authors of the paper posted at;

What are you talking about? You’re basing this on a patent application and a mechanistic study. This is the lowest level of evidence possible. This type of research is spammed everywhere.

1 Like

I’m a little confused here. Hope smb could clarify. Those who are trying now the DAV therapy, which is pretty controversial imo, are doing it because they have active cancer? Or is it to prevent any cancer in the future?

4 Likes

Entering week 3 feel fine- no side effects of any kind this week! Will continue the experiment! I decided not to have my blood tested until the antibiotics are completely out of my body, so probably mid November

3 Likes

So in absolute terms, if you were taking the doses described in the test and were already at risk for CVD, you increased your risk of death by 0.0245%.

“For this study, the underlying population is that of Tennessee Medicaid enrollees who have either a study antibiotic prescription or who have some portion of their Medicaid experience
selected as a nonuser control period.”

“Persons with low incomes are more likely to be Medicaid recipients or uninsured, have poor-quality health care, and seek health care less often; when they do seek health care, it is more likely to be for an emergency.”

“Low SES is an important determinant of access to health care. Persons with low incomes are more likely to be Medicaid recipients or uninsured, have poor-quality health care, and seek health care less often; when they do seek health care, it is more likely to be for an emergency.”

You know that people on Medicaid are exclusively people of the lowest economic status. To obtain Medicaid you basically have to have very little or no income. People enrolled in Medicaid are people with confounding medical risks.

“People on Medicaid are more likely to smoke, and smoking-related diseases are a major driver of Medicaid spending. Comprehensive Medicaid coverage of smoking cessation counseling and medications can help people on Medicaid quit smoking.”
Smokers and obesity were not excluded from the study you cite.

Bottom line: The cohort of this study is on Medicaid, from Tennessee, and not likely to be following a healthy lifestyle. The increased death rate for this group is minimal for users of azithromycin. No mention of obesity or many other confounding factors. The study was done in 2012 and a decade later no one is raising an alarm or suggesting that azithromycin not be prescribed or taken off the market.

A 2023 JAMA study found that: "Receiving azithromycin versus standard care was not significantly associated with death"
These were patients being treated for COVID-19 and only “Unvaccinated Patients With COVID‐19 and Preexisting Cardiovascular Disease” experienced an increase in death rate.

https://www.nejm.org/doi/suppl/10.1056/NEJMoa1003833/suppl_file/nejmoa1003833_appendix.pdf
https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/full/10.1161/JAHA.122.028939
Increase Medicaid coverage of evidence-based treatment to help people quit using tobacco — TU‑16 - Healthy People 2030 | health.gov.

9 Likes

The stopped clinical trial showing an increase in cancer relapse and death rate is more important.

My suggestion for you is to stop worrying about it and don’t take azithromycin.

1 Like

Speak for myself, I am doing this{DAV Therapy] for the possibility of longevity and as “cheap insurance” to remove and or lower cancer stem cells{as in my view all people have cancerous cells systemically] you do not go to sleep and wake up with a measurable cancer diagnosis. Takes years to develop.

4 Likes

Very astute observation, IMO. Thanks.

3 Likes

I think I am confused, too.
I would assume that yes, anyone with a cancer diagnosis might be trying this procedure.
However, the protocol is also suggested to be able to kill off senescent cells and so reduce the senescent cell burden that is proposed to contribute to the aging process.
So, 2 possible reasons to try it.
Please correct me if I’m wrong.

3 Likes

Speaking of spamming…

2 Likes

I do that “cheap insurance” thing by taking rapamycin with a bunch of supplements, exercising, and having a non-damaging diet.

4 Likes

Publication from Pfizer

Summary

 A clinical trial ALLOZITHRO1 which investigated long-term azithromycin to prevent bronchiolitis obliterans syndrome (BOS) in patients who underwent allogenic Hematopoietic Stem Cell Transplantation (HSCT) for hematological malignancy was terminated early after an increased risk of relapses was seen in patients taking azithromycin compared with placebo.

 Although it is not clear how azithromycin could have contributed to the observed higher rate of hematological relapses, in the study, it is concluded that long term azithromycin exposure following HSCT may include risks which exceed the anticipated benefits.

 Azithromycin is not authorized for prophylaxis of BOS in patients undergoing HSCT.

Background on the safety concern

The French Clinical trial entitled ALLOZITHRO “Evaluation of the efficacy of azithromycin to
prevent bronchiolitis obliterans syndrome after allogenic hematopoietic stem cell
transplantation” (NO EudraCT: 2013-000499) sponsored by the French academic institution
belonging to Hospitals in Paris, “Assistance publique des hopitaux de Paris”, investigated
whether early prophylactic azithromycin would improve airflow decline-free survival 2 years after
HSCT.

Study design:
This study was a randomized placebo controlled parallel group trial conducted in
19 academic transplant centers in France. Enrolled patients were 16 years or older who were
undergoing HSCT due to hematologic malignancy. The enrollment period was February 2014 to
August 2015. A total of 480 patients were randomized: 243 patients were to receive
> azithromycin (250 mg) 3 times weekly for 2 years; 237 patients were to receive placebo for two
years, starting at the time of conditioning regimen. The immunomodulating effects of
azithromycin therapy were evaluated when used for the long term prevention of BOS.

Results: The ALLOZITHRO study treatments (azithromycin/placebo) were terminated on the
> 26th December 2016 i.e. at thirteen months after completing recruitment

1 Like

Right, its mainly lab studies, but with a glimmer of clinical evidence from the doxycycline study that made me consider it (later contradicted by the study you linked to showing increased cancer relapse rate)

"Our clinical pilot study aimed to determine whether short-term pre-operative treatment with oral doxycycline results in reduction of CSCs (cancer stem cells) in early breast cancer patients.

Methods: Doxycycline was administered orally for 14 days before surgery for a daily dose of 200 mg. Immuno-histochemical analysis of formalin-fixed paraffin-embedded (FFPE) samples from 15 patients, of which 9 were treated with doxycycline and 6 were controls (no treatment), was performed with known biomarkers of “stemness” (CD44, ALDH1), mitochondria (TOMM20), cell proliferation (Ki67, p27), apoptosis (cleaved caspase-3), and neo-angiogenesis (CD31). For each patient, the analysis was performed both on pre-operative specimens (core-biopsies) and surgical specimens. Changes from baseline to post-treatment were assessed with MedCalc 12 (unpaired t-test) and ANOVA.

Results: Post-doxycycline tumor samples demonstrated a statistically significant decrease in the stemness marker CD44 (p-value < 0.005), when compared to pre-doxycycline tumor samples. More specifically, CD44 levels were reduced between 17.65 and 66.67%, in 8 out of 9 patients treated with doxycycline. In contrast, only one patient showed a rise in CD44, by 15%. Overall, this represents a positive response rate of nearly 90%. Similar results were also obtained with ALDH1, another marker of stemness. In contrast, markers of mitochondria, proliferation, apoptosis, and neo-angiogenesis, were all similar between the two groups’

2 Likes

In that study it says the following:

Azithromycin therapy was consistently associated with an increased risk of AHF in patients with preexisting CVD (risk ratio [RR], 1.48 [95% CI, 1.06–2.06]).

The comparison wasn’t between vaccinated and unvaccinated people, but it’s true that those with preexisting cardiovascular disease were associated to have a higher rate of acute heart failure using Azithromycin.

A 2020 JAMA study showed the following assosciation:

Results The study included 7 824 681 antibiotic exposures, including 1 736 976 azithromycin exposures (22.2%) and 6 087 705 amoxicillin exposures (77.8%), among 2 929 008 unique individuals (mean [SD] age, 50.7 [12.3] years; 1 810 127 [61.8%] women). Azithromycin was associated with a significantly increased hazard of cardiovascular death (hazard ratio [HR], 1.82; 95% CI, 1.23-2.67) but not sudden cardiac death (HR, 1.59; 95% CI, 0.90-2.81) within 5 days of exposure. No increases in risk were found 6 to 10 days after exposure. Similar results were observed in patients within the top decile of cardiovascular risk (HR, 1.71; 95% CI, 1.06-2.76). Azithromycin was also associated with an increased risk of noncardiovascular death (HR, 2.17; 95% CI, 1.44-3.26) and all-cause mortality (HR, 2.00; 95% CI, 1.51-2.63) within 5 days of exposure.

It was also from a diverse population based on data from Kaiser Permanente:

Kaiser Permanente California consists of 2 regions, Northern California and Southern California, with a combined membership of more than 8.2 million individuals. The demographic profile of the Kaiser Permanente California membership is racially, ethnically, and socioeconomically diverse and closely resembles the underlying populations of Northern and Southern California

The association they speculate is because of cardiac arrythmias:

Reports of an association of erythromycin, one of the first macrolide antibiotics, with QT interval prolongation and cardiac arrhythmias first appeared more than 20 years ago.16-19 Subsequently, cardiac arrhythmias have been reported for clarithromycin and azithromycin, and macrolide antibiotics, as a class, are now known to cause QT prolongation in some at-risk populations.20 In most of the case reports of macrolide antibiotic use and cardiac arrhythmias, patients had other factors that put them at an increased risk for cardiac arrhythmias, including underlying cardiac disease (ie, bradycardia, congestive heart failure, baseline QT prolongation, cardiomyopathy, atrial fibrillation, and myocardial ischemia), metabolic anomalies that increase the risk of arrhythmia (ie, hypokalemia, hypocalcemia, hypomagnesemia, and hypoxia), or concomitant use of other medications known to prolong the QT interval.21